Team DB version 0.4 available!  FF, Defenders, Alpha Flight & More!
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 01, 2001 at 20:11:42:

Hi, guys!

The database is growing!  I've added chronologies for the Defenders, 
Fantastic Four, Alpha Flight, Salem's Seven and more.  I've updated 
rosters, added more web site links, and fixed various errors.

Eventually, I'd like to expand the database to include more data on 
other comic topics (such as issue indexes, etc.) so feel free to 
suggest or contribute data or corrections.

Here's the link to download...
http://www.users.qwest.net/~fjvirginia/chronodb.zip

Thanks!

			*	*	*

Scarlet Witch Correction
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 02, 2001 at 08:43:15:

I just finished reading Quasar 17 and I noticed an appearance by 
the Scarlet Witch.  Quicksilver also appears and his chronology 
lists it as occurring between AWC 63 and AWC 65.  The Witch has 
the same two listings with nothing in between, so I guess the 
correction for Scarlet Witch would be...

AWC 63
Q 17
AWC 65

The issue was published in 1990, so it was probably originally 
part of a gap.

Thank you.

			*	*	*

Star Trek Comic Book Stardates [sort-of off topic]
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 02, 2001 at 18:34:05:

Star Trek Comic Book Stardates [By all publishers]

Notes:

1.) In order to be able to sort the dates in chronological order, 
I've added two zeros (and moved the decimal point) for Marvel's 
"Early Voyages" series.  I've also added a single zero prior to 
all Original Series dates.

2.) If the date ends with an "M" that means that the date is 
"made-up" based on the issue's likely chronological placement.

3.) If the date ends with "adj" that means that the printed date 
could not possibly be correct, and therefore it was adjusted to 
compensate.

4.) This list is far from complete -- please post or e-mail 
additions.

00237.81 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 1
00238.57 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 2
00238.63M  - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 3
00239.45M  - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 4
00239.66 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 5
00259.9 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 6
00360.3 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 7
00361.6 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 8
00371.2 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 9
00371.7 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 10
00389.4 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 11
01926.12 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 12
01927.4 - Star Trek [Gold Key] "The Animal People" 
03001.3 - Star Trek [Whitman] "The Psychocrystals" 
03005.1 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 2] 58-FB
03006.4 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 2] 59
03114.1 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 2] 60
03221.9 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 33
03471.4 - Star Trek [Gold Key] "The Mimicking Menace" 
03708.2 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] Annual 3-FB
03847.5 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 7
04740.5 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 38
05049.2 - Star Trek/X-Men [Marvel] 
05268.1 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] Annual 3
05992.4 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] Annual 5
05993.6M   - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] DC (Vol. 2)
05996.5 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] DC (Vol. 2)
06121.8 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] Annual 2
06218.9 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 77
06221.4 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 78
06228.5 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 79
06352.4 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 80
07416.2 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 11
07417.4 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 4
07420.1 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 5
07521.4 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 6
07523.5 - Star Trek: Untold Voyages [Marvel] 2
>07641.8 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 8
07673.6 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 9
07685.3 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 10
07880.7adj - Star Trek: Untold Voyages [Marvel] 3
07964.5adj - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 12*
>08022.5adj - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 13**
08124.5 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 15***
08140.1 - Star Trek [Marvel - Vol. 1] 17
08163.5 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] Annual 3
08261.1 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 5
08263.5 - Star Trek Special [DC] 1
08475.2 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 17
08490.7 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 2
08495.6 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 9
08496.9M   - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 10
08498.1 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 11
08526.8 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 12
08535.6 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 56
08538.2 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 22
08588.3 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 24
08620.3 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 30
08651.1 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 45
08668.2 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 58
08673.9 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 65
08674.8 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 66
08678.3 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 67
08684.2 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 68
08685.1 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 61
08688.8 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 69
08690.3 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 70
08691.2 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 71
08748.4 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 72
08826.2 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 51
08889.2M   - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 63-Epilogue
>08890.1 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 24
08901.8 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 25
08914.6 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 50
09000.4 - Star Trek [DC - Vol 2] 42
09001.3 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 52
09219.7 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 54
09521.9 - Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 47
09522.0 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 14
41187.5 - Star Trek: Early Voyages [Marvel] 15
41190.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation Mini-Series [DC] 1
41195.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation Mini-Series [DC] 2
41198.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation Mini-Series [DC] 3
41198.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation Mini-Series [DC] 4
41199.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation Mini-Series [DC] 5
42102.500  - Star Trek: Next Generation Mini-Series [DC] 6
42102.5 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 51
42305.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 51
42307.2 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 1
42315.8 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 2
42360.0 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 3
42361.8 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 3
43131.4 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 4
43201.8 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 18
43202.5 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 5
43265.4 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 6
43266.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 7
43268.1 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 8
43269.1 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 9
43269.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 10
43270.4 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 11
43423.6 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 12
43738.8 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 13
43810.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] Annual 1
43811.1 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 14
43878.1 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 15
43887.2M   - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 16
43902.8M   - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 17
44272.5M   - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 29
44290.4 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 19
44295.6 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 20
44296.2 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 21
44297.3M   - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 22
44298.2 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 23
44395.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 24
44396.0 - Star Trek: Next Generation: Modala Imperative Mini-Series 
[DC] 1
44397.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation: Modala Imperative Mini-Series 
[DC] 2
44398.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation: Modala Imperative Mini-Series 
[DC] 3
44624.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation: Modala Imperative Mini-Series 
[DC] 4
45265.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] Annual 2
45265.7 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 25
45265.9 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 26
45267.2M   - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 27
45482.6 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 28
45482.9 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 30
45582.4M   - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 31
45838.4 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 32
45948.8 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 36
46253.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] Annual 3
46254.4 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 39
46257.8 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 40
46258.2 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Malibu] 1
46301.8 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Malibu] 2
46318.6 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 45
46479.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 46
46481.2M   - Star Trek: Next Generation: Shadowheart Mini-Series 
[DC] 1
46483.5M   - Star Trek: Next Generation: Shadowheart Mini-Series 
[DC] 2
46485.7M   - Star Trek: Next Generation: Shadowheart Mini-Series 
[DC] 3
46759.5 - Star Trek: Next Generation: Shadowheart Mini-Series [DC] 4
47268.4 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] Annual 4
47269.1 - Star Trek: Next Generation/Deep Space Nine Mini-Series 
[DC] 1
47270.9 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine/Next Generation Mini-Series 
[Malibu] 1
47272.1M   - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine/Next Generation Mini-Series 
[Malibu] 2
47961.2 - Star Trek: Next Generation/Deep Space Nine Mini-Series 
[DC] 2
47962.6 - Star Trek: Next Generation: Ill Wind Mini-Series [DC] 2
48015.1 - Star Trek: Next Generation: Ill Wind Mini-Series [DC] 3
48252.6 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] Annual 6
48273.5 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 72
>48319.4 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Malibu] 14
48573.3 - Star Trek: Next Generation [DC] 76
48575.6M   - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine: Maquis Mini-Series [Malibu] 1
48577.4M   - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine: Maquis Mini-Series [Malibu] 2
48979.1 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine: Maquis Mini-Series [Malibu] 3
49237.1 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine: Maquis Mini-Series [Malibu] 4
49641.6 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Marvel] 2
49924.6 - Star Trek: Voyager [Marvel] 5
50444.1 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Marvel] 6
50796.5 - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Marvel] 9
51019.3 - Star Trek: Voyager [Marvel] 13
51019.6 - Star Trek: Voyager [Marvel] 14
51123.9 - Star Trek: Voyager [Marvel] 15

*08180.7 was the printed stardate, but it is not possible given 
that the issue depicts Motion Picture uniforms, but the date 
places it after Wrath of Kahn (wherein starfleet had a new 
uniform scheme).

**08264.5 was the printed stardate, but it is not possible given 
that the issue depicts Motion Picture uniforms, but the date 
places it after Wrath of Kahn (wherein starfleet had a new 
uniform scheme).

***08822.5 was the printed stardate, but it is not possible 
given that the issue depicts Motion Picture uniforms, but the 
date places it after Wrath of Kahn (wherein starfleet had a 
new uniform scheme).

Issues known to have no apparent printed stardate (and are not 
listed above):
Star Trek [DC - Vol. 1] 64
Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Malibu] 3
Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Marvel] 3
Star Trek: Deep Space Nine [Marvel] 5
Star Trek: Deep Space Nine: Hearts & Minds Mini-Series [Malibu] 1
Star Trek: Next Generation: Perchance to Dream Mini-Series [Wildstorm] 1
Star Trek: Next Generation: Shadowheart Mini-Series [DC] 4

			*	*	*

Re: Star Trek Comic Book Stardates [sort-of off topic]
Posted by StAkAr Karnak on June 04, 2001 at 09:14:10:
In Reply to: Star Trek Comic Book Stardates [sort-of off topic]
posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 02, 2001 at 18:34:05:

[Stardate lists snipped]

While the amount of effort in your work is impressive, and your 
team databases might conceivably be helpful to the project, this 
sort of thing is a little off track.  Just because something was 
published by Marvel, that doesn't make it MCP game automatically.  
You might try rec.arts.startrek.tech instead.

For the record, I loved PAD's DC Trek and Marvel's Early Voyages 
(not that I think Enterprise is a good idea...)

-sk

			*	*	*

Ghost Rider & Midnight Sons Unlimited 6
Posted by douglas C on June 03, 2001 at 07:36:03:

As far as I can tell, the flashback tale of Dr Strange's takes 
place between Ghost Rider II 60 and Marvel Two-In-One 80.  After 
the end of GRII60 the nightmares must start, and by that time 
Blaze is already thinking of Ghost Rider as a complete separate 
entity.  He then begins a long and uneventful journey to see Dr 
Strange, which brings to NY to meet up with the Thing in MTIO.  
Can anyone verify this, or show me wrong?

			*	*	*

Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
Posted by Zevad on June 04, 2001 at 20:57:09:

I hear he first apperaed in Captain Britain Weekly # 1 so he wrote 
and drew his first apperance/created him? Thanks a lot if you can help.

			*	*	*

Re: Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
Posted by Sean Curtin on June 04, 2001 at 22:08:30:
In Reply to: Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
posted by Zevad on June 04, 2001 at 20:57:09:

His first 10+ appearances were writen by Chris Claremont and 
drawn by Herb Trimpe, according to Claremont's introduction to 
the Captain Britain TPB.

-Sean Curtin

			*	*	*

Re: Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
Posted by Andy Holcombe on June 06, 2001 at 01:43:22:
In Reply to: Re: Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
posted by Sean Curtin on June 04, 2001 at 22:08:30:

> His first 10+ appearances were writen by Chris Claremont and 
drawn by Herb Trimpe, according to Claremont's introduction to 
the Captain Britain TPB.

That's the US appearances.  He was in Marvel UK before.  Alan's 
Moore and Davis did a lot of work with him, but did not create 
him I think.  Look in the intro to X-Men Archives: Captain 
Britian #1.  I also think he debuted in Daredevils whichwas 
a Marvel US reprint in the UK until they started Captain Britian.

			*	*	*

Re: Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
Posted by Yellow Claw on June 07, 2001 at 04:57:17:
In Reply to: Re: Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
posted by Andy Holcombe on June 06, 2001 at 01:43:22:

> That's the US appearances.  He was in Marvel UK before.  Alan's 
Moore and Davis did a lot of work with him, but did not create him 
I think.  Look in the intro to X-Men Archives: Captain Britian #1.  
I also think he debuted in Daredevils whichwas a Marvel US reprint 
in the UK until they started Captain Britian.

No - Claremont and Trimpe did indeed create him first in Captain 
Britain (vol. 1) issue 1, a Marvel UK magazine, mostly in black 
and white and usually featuring back-up reprints of Marvel US 
stories, including Nick Fury and SHIELD stuff. It was also Claremont 
who first used him in a mainstream Marvel comic, which I think was 
an issue of Marvel Team-Up. 

Cheers,

Yellow Claw.

			*	*	*

Re: Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
Posted by Thibault on April 04, 2002 at 07:22:01:
In Reply to: Re: Who created Captain Britain? Can anyone help?
posted by Andy Holcombe on June 06, 2001 at 01:43:22:

> 
> > His first 10+ appearances were writen by Chris Claremont 
and drawn by Herb Trimpe, according to Claremont's introduction 
to the Captain Britain TPB.

> That's the US appearances.  He was in Marvel UK before.  Alan's 
Moore and Davis did a lot of work with him, but did not create him 
I think.  Look in the intro to X-Men Archives: Captain Britian #1.  
I also think he debuted in Daredevils whichwas a Marvel US reprint 
in the UK until they started Captain Britian.

The first answer is right. The second is false. Captain Britain 
started in 1976 in its own title in Britain. He was in fact created 
by Chris Claremont, who wrote his first 10 adeventures. I should 
know: I asked him last week!

The first series lasted for around 40 issues, first in colour then 
in B&W. Then it was dropped and Cap only made cameos in some US 
series, such as Spider Man.

The second series started in the early eighties, first in several 
short-lived UK magazines (Moore and Davis), then in its own title, 
which lasted for 14 issues (Delano and Davis). Then Excalibur was 
born.

Cheers
Thibault

			*	*	*

Why was Marvel UK created?
Posted by Zevad on June 05, 2001 at 14:17:19:

What was it's purpose? How many properties did they create?

			*	*	*

Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
Posted by Andy Holcombe on June 06, 2001 at 01:39:49:
In Reply to: Why was Marvel UK created?
posted by Zevad on June 05, 2001 at 14:17:19:

I don't know the whole story, but they started off doing weekly 
reprints of various Marvel titles.  Captain Britian was one of the 
first properties created by Marvel UK.  Many of his stories were 
recently collected in X-Men Archives: Captain Britian, plus an 
older and future trade paperback.  Others include Death's Head (I), 
Night Raven, Dragon Claws, Transformers, Action Force/G.I. Joe 
European Missions, Strip (anthology title with Death's Head, 
Punisher, and others including non-super-hero), Dr. Who, and 
the Knights of Pendragon.  They collected the Death's Head stories 
in The Life and Times of Death's Head and many of the Night Raven 
stories in Nigh Raven: The Collected Stories.  They also produced 
the Death's Head: The Body in Question graphic novel, which also 
ran in Strip.

Right before the direct market collapse in the early-mid 90's 
they produced a line of titles for the U.S. market.  The ones 
I've read were mediocre at best and horrible at worst (bear in 
mind this is just the first nine moths of the run).  While the 
line features an over abundance of Marvel (and intraline) guest 
stars, I've only seen Death's Head I (She-Hulk, Fantastic Four, 
Marvel Comics Presents), Nigh Raven (Fury/Black Widow: Death 
Duty) and Motormouth and Killpower (Hulk) make appearances in 
regular Marvel titles, and Death's Head II in What If...?

Anyway, the line included Death's Head II (mini and regular 
series), Warheads (interesting concept), Motormouth (and Killpower), 
more Knights of Pendragon, Hell's/Dark Angel, Digitek, Mys-Tech 
Wars, Death's Head II and Killpower: Battle Tide I and II, Code 
Name: Genetix, Killpower: The Early Years, Nikki Doyle: Wild Thing, 
Super Soldiers, Shadow Riders, Cyberspace 3000, Warheads: Black 
Dawn, Black Axe, Death's Head II and the Origin of Die Cut, 
Death^3, Die Cut vs. G-Force, Dark Guard, Gun Runner, Gene 
Dogs, Genetix, Plasmer, Die Cut, Death Metal vs. Genetix, Death 
Metal, Death-Wreck, and Death's Head II Gold.  They also 
represented the orginal Death's Head series plus some appearances 
in Strip, Dr. Who, and a new linking story with Death's Head II 
bundled in a package called The Incomplete Death's Head.

I can't wait for someone to order the chronology for this line.

The announcements pages and some footnotes mention some other 
titles, but I haven't found any copies or other mention of them 
(Killfrenzy, Wild Angels, Red Mist 20/20: Death Duty, Red Mist 20/20: 
Roid Rage, Red Mist 20/20: Bloodrush, Time Stryke, and Ten-Sec).

			*	*	*

Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
Posted by Paul O'Brien on June 08, 2001 at 13:54:01:
In Reply to: Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
posted by Andy Holcombe on June 06, 2001 at 01:39:49:

> I don't know the whole story, but they started off doing weekly 
reprints of various Marvel titles.  Captain Britian was one of the 
first properties created by Marvel UK

It was the first, and it was actually produced by Marvel US, since 
they didn't trust their UK office to do it.  Marvel UK opposed 
Captain Britain, quite rightly, as a terrible idea which would 
never work in the UK market.  They suggested an anthology book 
with a whole load of UK creators.  Marvel US told them to get 
stuffed.

Captain Britain dutifully tanked in the UK market, and it took 
them ages to get it to work in any shape at all.  The creators 
Marvel UK's editor had had in mind for his anthology title all 
buggered off to Fleetway to found 2000AD, which has to rank as 
one of Marvel's biggest missed opportunities.

A curious footnote to Marvel UK history is that the UK office 
editor during this period was Neil Tennant, who left publishing 
a few years later and formed the Pet Shop Boys.  Honest.

			*	*	*

Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
Posted by Kieron Mullens on October 24, 2001 at 08:57:58:
In Reply to: Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
posted by Paul O'Brien on June 08, 2001 at 13:54:01:

I guess the main reason Marvel UK was created in the 1970s was 
that the comic buying public were used to newstand titles appearing 
on a weekly frequency, rather than the monthly US imports.  
Unfortunately, Marvel UK's never shaken off that "poor cousin" 
tag, despite giving the likes of Alan Moore, Alan Davis, Steve 
Dillon, Bryan Hitch, Liam Sharp & Gary Frank a valuable start.

The 1980s were definitely the most creatively memorable for the 
company:  Captain Britain got a makeover to rival that of a certain 
Dark Knight;  Night Raven is an overlooked gem;  even their own 
takes on Hulk, Spider-Man, Black Knight & Ant Man (true!) deserve 
a second look.

The 1990s "UK Explosion", which quickly imploded, was a missed 
opportunity.  Despite some good creators, they also produced a 
range of poorly executed titles that were painful to read.

These days, having been taken over by Panini, the titles are 
mainly bumper reprints of the most popular US titles - currently 
X-Men, Spider-Man, The Avengers, & Wolverine & Gambit - which 
form a cheap alternative to buying the US issues, particularly 
as they reprint 'classics' (current examples being the Kitty 
Pryde & Wolverine mini, & Amazing Spider-Man (Vol 1) #14).  
Originated material is limited to the Dr Who comic strip (ongoing 
since 1979 & another overlooked gem) & a Spider-Man title aimed 
at the younger market & providing 11 new pages every 2 months.

Marvel UK's 30th anniversary is in Oct 2002, but I'm not sure how 
big the celebration will be...

			*	*	*

Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
Posted by Matt on April 01, 2002 at 22:13:02:
In Reply to: Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
posted by Andy Holcombe on June 06, 2001 at 01:39:49:

Dredging up old threads, I know, but I chanced upon this...

Marvel UK's home produced output dwindled after 1990... most of 
it's best artists and writers were being poached by US publishers 
or by Fleetway for 2000AD.  After several forays into trying to 
release "It's Wicked" and "Big Comic" (I think it was called, 
or possibly "bumper comic", although that may be a different 
publisher) as Beano and Dandy worriers, they began to try and 
re-orientate their output in the "comix" direction and find a 
more mature audience.  Even the soap opera that was UK Transformers 
gave way to US reprints as the best UK writers moved across there, 
but for a time before, very little UK strips had been produced 
in favour of re-runs of earlier home-grown strips.

After Dragons Claws, Death's Head and Knights of Pendragon 
started to more represent the MUK brand, a bold attempt was 
made to steal 2000AD's crown... this was Overkill, released 
in April '92.  Much more Adult than the previous output, it 
featured 6-page installments of the aforementioned Motormouth, 
Death's Head 2, Hell's Angel, Digitek, Warheads and several 
others, all united around the Mys-Tech organisation.  I don't 
know how long the comic lasted, but I don't think it was long, 
and MUK's original output, I think, had ceased by 1995.

There is little information on MUK characters on the web.  In 
it's 15-or-so active years many strips were produced by MUK with 
many talented artists and writers passing through it's publications.  
It had a unique flavour, and one very different to both Marvel US 
and 2000AD, and as a kid buying from the local newsagent, hardly 
venturing into specialist shops, these were the comics I grew up 
knowing.

Marvel UK produced original strip content for franchises like 
Transformers, The Real Ghostbusters and Action Force (GI Joe), 
although I believe other titles like Defenders of the Earth, 
Thundercats and most other toy/cartoon franchises where entirely 
US reprints, usually featuring an 11-page strip (half a monthly 
US strip) and a 6-page segmented reprint as "back-up strip" 
such as Machine-Man, Alpha Flight, more Action Force etc. Most 
weighed in at 24 pages.  Strips from various titles would be 
collected in holiday specials known as "Collected Comics".  In 
1991, MUK took on the Star Trek: The Next Generation franchise, 
using a mixture of Starlog and DC strip material. This lasted 
in a fortnightly format, wntil it was changed to a monthly, 
glossier format that lasted only 4-or-so issues - oddly so, 
considering the enduring success of Star Trek in the UK, however, 
MUK seemed to drop other titles around this time.

As the UK versions were always printed in a glossier larger 
format, US Strips were either enlarged, showing larger than 
normal shading dots, of bordered in an ugly fashion.

Marvel UK's only enduring success is Dr Who magazine, which 
I *think* still runs, or was a few months ago, beginning in 
the late 70s.

			*	*	*

Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
Posted by Nathanael Nerode on June 20, 2002 at 20:42:03:
In Reply to: Re: Why was Marvel UK created?
posted by Andy Holcombe on June 06, 2001 at 01:39:49:

> I can't wait for someone to order the chronology for this line.

Indeed.  This is not only a nightmare of chronology; the early 90's 
stuff is such a load of crap I actually recycled quite a lot of 
copies of them.  The most irritating thing is that most of them 
were miniseries, or series which ended up being as short as 
miniseries; there are multiple number 1s published in the same 
*year* for some titles, where one is the 'miniseries', one is 
the 'regular series', etc., etc.

I have all (I think) of 'Incomplete Death's Head', and most of 
Death's Head II (mini and regular).  I might have some of the 
other 'Death' titles; I used to have more but I recycled the 
ones without Death's Head in them on the grounds that they were 
very, very, bad.

The 80's stuff (Death's Head I, Dragon Claws, etc.) is actually, 
on the whole, good, and as such it's a lot harder to get copies 
of.

"Doctor Who Magazine" existed prior to "Marvel UK", although it 
was always published by a UK division of Marvel, and it was the 
only non-reprint publication to survive the death of Marvel UK.  
It still exists.  Of course, it's a licensed property based on 
a TV show with its own continuity, and most people do not consider 
it part of the Marvel Universe.  Then again, a few of the writers 
during the early 90s period seemed to treat it as part of the 
Marvel Universe.  Totally confused situation.

Death's Head, of course, started out in Transformers (whose 
canonicity in the Marvel Universe is a good question...), stayed 
there for something like 50 issues, then bounced into Doctor Who 
before getting his own book, and eventually ended up as a guest 
in She-Hulk and other places.  Probably the best explanation for 
him is that he's travelled between universes a few times. :-P

Marvel UK provides some of the nastiest continuity tangles you're 
ever likely to see.  

I don't think anyone's mentioned yet the stories published in 
the magazine-sized printed-on-cheap-paper "The Incredible Hulk 
Presents"; some were reprints, but there were also brand new 
stories... I've been trying to get hold of issues of it for a 
long time (for the original Doctor Who stories), but it's really 
hard to find.

Probably it's best from an analysis point of view to consider 
the material exported to the US separately from the material 
intended only for British audiences.  It might also be helpful 
to separate the 80s from the 90s, since editorial policy seems 
to have undergone some radical changes during that time.

			*	*	*

Captain America WWII  chronology
Posted by Ron Flick on June 05, 2001 at 21:09:04:

I do not agree with much of the chronology of Captain America's 
WWII adventures, including both GA and SA stories that have been 
accepted into the Marvel Universe.  Many stories are out of order 
and many are missing. For the last four or five years I have 
aquired most, if not all, of these stories and have begun my 
own detailed chronology, incorporating the Red Skull, Invaders, 
Sgt. Fury, etc.  Who do I speak to in order to straighten some of 
this out?

			*	*	*

Re: Captain America WWII  chronology
Posted by Russ Chappell on June 05, 2001 at 22:00:05:
In Reply to: Captain America WWII  chronology
posted by Ron Flick on June 05, 2001 at 21:09:04:

> Who do I speak to in order to straighten some of this out?

You're already speaking to us. I have almost none of the Golden 
Age stories, so don't make any claims to being an authority on 
the era. If you have the books, we'd welcome your input, right 
here.

A word of caution: If you expect us to listen to you, don't just 
say "I'm right; you're wrong; change it." Tell us why, and how, 
you're right.

Welcome aboard, Ron.

			*	*	*

Re: Captain America WWII  chronology
Posted by Ron Flick on June 08, 2001 at 17:01:53:
In Reply to: Re: Captain America WWII  chronology
posted by Russ Chappell on June 05, 2001 at 22:00:05:


I apologize if my original message sounded a bit harsh.  It wasn't 
meant to sound that way at all.  I am thrilled to see someone 
putting this together.  Right now I am reorganizing my notes to 
match your format and will get the information to you in a week 
or so.  You can then look it over.  Thanks and keep it going.  

			*	*	*

Team DB version 0.6 available!  New look!  Over 180 teams!
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 06, 2001 at 11:16:43:

Hi, guys!

The database is growing! I've given the database a new look (I 
hope you like it).  I've added more chronologies as well as a 
bunch of new teams and web links. 

Feel free to suggest or contribute data or corrections.

Here's the link to download...
http://www.users.qwest.net/~fjvirginia/chronodb.zip<p>Thanks!

			*	*	*

Nocturne/Night Raven controversy
Posted by Randy Tischler on June 06, 2001 at 14:19:56:

I believe I posted the question here before or maybe have seen 
others discuss it here, but after reading a couple of the Nocturne 
issues, I'm pretty sure this was intended to be out of continuity.  
I've heard people say that there was no attention paid to details 
of past stories, etc., so it should just be discounted, but this 
series specifically addresses Night Raven as a pulp hero from a 
radio program, and additionally, in one scene, a police officer 
makes a comment on how he's glad there aren't any real caped heroes 
in the world (or something to that affect).  Just thought I'd post 
that observation.

Randy

			*	*	*

Re: Nocturne/Night Raven controversy
Posted by John Mc Donagh on January 25, 2002 at 11:21:57:
In Reply to: Nocturne/Night Raven controversy
posted by Randy Tischler on June 06, 2001 at 14:19:56:

   This has been dealt with extensively at the following site:
marvunapp.com/Appendix/nhtraven.htm
and then came Nocturne (by Dan Abnett and John Fonteriz, June 1995), 
which complete changed everything, making him from the UK, and a 
high-tech vigilante, and a bunch of other changes (Jess Nevins 
details all of the differences quite nicely at his pre-marvel 
site, 
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Olympus/7160/retcon2p.html). 

Anyway, the two identities are clearly not compatible. Here are 
my thoughts:

1) The original persona/history/origin, we'll call it NR1, came 
first (and has a good 30-40+ issues dealing with it).

2) NR1 has been shown to interact with the Marvel Universe--Directly, 
with the Black Widow--Indirectly, as part of the computer files of 
Mastermind, the former robot servant of the Braddocks (see above).

3) The second version, NR2, was all for the purpose of bringing out 
a new character, Nocturne, and making him popular. It's ret-con, no 
question about it.

4) NR2 does not interact with anyone else from the Marvel Universe, 
nor are they even mentioned. There's even a statement to the effect 
that there hadn't even been costumed characters around in recent 
years before Nocturne showed up.

My conclusion: NR1 is the Marvel Universe version. NR2 is out-of-
continuity, or at least not from "Earth-Prime." Actually, the 
Nocturne story came out just a year before the whole Heroes Reborn 
dilly-o. I'd put the story there, or in another alternate Universe, 
or just leave it as non-continuity. 

It's probably a moot point, as its not likely that Night Raven will 
be seen again, but that's what I'm going with.

...but, if we could get Moore and Davis to write a new series...
maybe in the MAX line...mmm...go-o-o-o-o-od.

			*	*	*

Question: John Romita in Marvel Two-In-One Annual #1
Posted by Francisco Martnez on June 07, 2001 at 16:50:48:

In Marvel Two-In-One Annual #1 appears a child named Johnny Romita. 
Is John Romita the artist?

			*	*	*

Index for Quasar 44 and 45
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 08, 2001 at 20:51:57:

Hey, Russ.

I'm not sure you need this information, but I was reading these 
issues anyway, so I thought I'd put it together.  I am in the 
process of reading the entire Quasar series, so if you want this 
info for the other Quasar issues that are not listed in the MCP, 
let me know...

----QUASAR 44----
published March 1993

CHARACTERS
Antibody(ies) (last in Q 43, next in Q 45)**
Ballantine, Devon (last in Q 35, next in ? -- brother of Kayla 
Ballantine)
Ballantine, Kayla (last in Q 43, next in Q 45)*
Black Widow (sometime between A 357 and A 374)
Kismet [formerly "Her"] (last in Q 43, next in Q 45)
Peggy (Avengers' employee - last in ?, next in Q 45)
Quagmire (last in Q 43, next in NW 32)
Quasar III (last in Q 43, next in Q 45)*
Steckley, Holly (last in Q 43, next in Q 45)
Tanaka, Ken (last in Q 41, next in ?)
Traci [sixteen year old waitress]
Two unnamed police officers.
Unnamed secretary (last in Q 41, next in ?)

TEAMS & GROUPS
None

LOCATIONS
New York
Planet of Scadam
Space

NOTES
*Both Kayla Ballantine and Quasar III possess a portion of the 
Starbrand power throughout this issue.
**From what I understand, Antibody (or Antibodies when broken 
into smaller pieces) is a character from the New Universe.

---QUASAR 45---
published April 1993

CHARACTERS
Antibody(ies) (last in Q 44, next in Q 46)
Ballantine, Kayla (last in Q 44, next in Q 46)*
Blazing Skull II [1st app. - real name is Scully] (next in Q 46)
Doctor Druid (unsure -- next in Q 46, but the 2 apps. go somewhere 
between CA 409 and A3 10)
Kismet [formerly "Her"] (last in Q 44, next in Q 46)
M'Kantu [1st app.] (next in Q 46)
Neutron (last in Q 33, next in Q 46)
Peggy (Avengers' employee - last in Q 44, next in ?)
The Presence (last in Q 20, next in Q 46)
Quasar III (last in Q 44, next in Q 46)*
Shadowoman [1st app.] (next in Q 46)
Steckley, Holly (last in Q 44, next in Q 46)
Unnamed member of the alien species known as The Dance (next in Q 46)

TEAMS & GROUPS
Shock Troop [1st app. - final panel only] (next in Q 46)

LOCATIONS
Planet of Scadam
Quantum Zone
Space

NOTES
*Both Kayla Ballantine and Quasar III possess a portion of the 
Starbrand power throughout this issue.

That's all for now.  Let me know if you want or need more for 
Quasar 46-60.

Thanks,
jf

			*	*	*

Index to Quasar #44-45 by Jimmy flowers.
Posted by S.houston on June 10, 2001 at 02:50:24:

Hey Jimmy, thats great work on the Quasar books, do you have an 
index to Quasar #1-43?

I'm sure that the MCP will need all the info you can provide on 
Quasar #46-60 - most of it will be filling in the "gap"

			*	*	*

Re: Index to Quasar #44-45 by Jimmy flowers.
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 10, 2001 at 21:12:29:
In Reply to: Index to Quasar #44-45 by Jimmy flowers.
posted by S.houston on June 10, 2001 at 02:50:24:

Unfortunately I did not do an index to Quasar 1-43 as I was 
reading.  It takes a lot of time, so I figured I would focus 
just on the issues that seemed to be missing from the MCP. 

Thanks.
jf

			*	*	*

Re: Index to Quasar #44-45 by Jimmy flowers.
Posted by Russ Chappell on June 10, 2001 at 22:23:27:
In Reply to: Index to Quasar #44-45 by Jimmy flowers.
posted by S.houston on June 10, 2001 at 02:50:24:

> I'm sure that the MCP will need all the info you can provide 
on Quasar #46-60 - most of it will be filling in the "gap"

No, actually, we don't. The books that we need help with are 
listed in the Closing The Gap section of the Project (you'll 
find a link to the left), and all of the books therein are 
from the second gap.

Jimmy is free to post his issue analyses here because they're 
on topic, but we won't be referring to them in our own analysis, 
when the time comes.

			*	*	*

Re: Index to Quasar #1-43
Posted by John Toasty Comerford on July 04, 2001 at 01:39:51:
In Reply to: Index to Quasar #44-45 by Jimmy flowers.
posted by S.houston on June 10, 2001 at 02:50:24:

Just so you know, Quasar 1,2,or 3 has a listing by Mark Gruenwald 
citing all of the characters appearances previous to that.  In the 
near future I will look into Quasar for you after I do some Iron 
Man as I found an immediate gap in the "Sentient Armor" listing. 
More on a later post.

			*	*	*

Red Skull  chronologies
Posted by Ron F. on June 10, 2001 at 21:48:03:

Here is the expanded chronology I have worked up for Red Skull/
Johann Schmidt.  I would like anyone's comments:
TOS 65-FB   early life
CA 300-FB   early life
CAC  7      GA canonical story
TOS 66/2    set in early 1942
TOS 67/2
TOS 68/2
TOS 69/2
TOS 70/2-BTS
TOS 71/2-BTS
INV  5      set in early 1942
INV  6
SGTF25      probably set in 1943
CA@  9      set in 1944
TS 72-CA@13 set in May 1945

As a Golden Age buff, I would also love to include the other GA 
appearances of the Red Skull as he appeared in the following 
titles:  

Young Allies 1 (preceding CAC 7)
CAC 4 and Young Allies 4 (following INV 6)
All Select 2 (following SGTF 25)
Also, I believe there should be an entry for the "first" Red 
Skull, even though he was an American imposter.  His short 
chronology would be...

CAC  1- TOS 65
CAC  3

Thank you for your consideration.  I will return with other 
early Captain America-related chronologies...

Ron 

			*	*	*

Re: Red Skull  chronologies
Posted by Ron F. on June 10, 2001 at 22:02:25:
In Reply to: Red Skull  chronologies
posted by Ron F. on June 10, 2001 at 21:48:03:

OOPS, I forgot to add the title to my suggested "first" Red Skull 
chronology.  It should read 
RED SKULL/ GEORGE MAXON
CAC 1 -TOS 65
CAC 3

I believe most everyone has accepted the first ten issues of 
Captain America Comics by Simon and Kirby into the Marvel Universe.  
Also Tales of Suspense 65 would assure that this Red Skull is 
canonical.

For a related discussion on the Captain America WWII years, see 
the followup to the  post titled "Invaders Chronology" about half-
way down the message board.  

			*	*	*

Re: Red Skull  chronologies
Posted by Yellow Claw on June 14, 2001 at 02:42:51:
In Reply to: Re: Red Skull  chronologies
posted by Ron F. on June 10, 2001 at 22:02:25:

Hi Ron, as you know, having been in e-mail contact with me, I'm 
slowly writing a Red Skull bio - the chronology above is fully 
supported by the reading I've done, and the inclusion of the GA 
issues, as you know, has been very helpful. So if Russ is reading 
this, I'd just like to say that I can back-up Ron's research after 
several e-mail discussions with him - this chronology seems to be 
accurate.

Cheers,

Yellow Claw.

			*	*	*

Re: Red Skull  chronologies
Posted by Ron F. on June 14, 2001 at 07:36:21:
In Reply to: Re: Red Skull  chronologies
posted by Yellow Claw on June 14, 2001 at 02:42:51:

I need to make three small corrections to the chronology 
submitted.

First of all, I listed CA 300-FB as an issue outlining the 
Red Skull's early life.  This should be CA 298-FB. 

Secondly, in the Golden Age issues not yet fully accepted into 
the Marvel Universe, I listed CAC 4 and Young Allies 4.  This 
should read CAC 16 and Young Allies 4, which were team-up issues.  

Thirdly, I failed to include the cameo appearance of the Red Skull 
in Marvel Universe 1.  This should be placed prior to CA @9.  

Thanks.

Ron

			*	*	*

Re: Red Skull  chronologies
Posted by Ron F. on July 04, 2001 at 09:53:41:
In Reply to: Re: Red Skull  chronologies
posted by Ron F. on June 14, 2001 at 07:36:21:

I would like to expand upon the the 1950s Commie Red Skull 
chronology....

RED SKULL II/ALBERT MALIK
pre-FF1 stories:
CA@13-FB  origin of Commie Red Skull
YOUNG MEN 24  
CA 155-FB
CA@13-FB   in Algeria
ASM @5-FB  incident with Peter Parker's parents 
ASM 366-FB  ""    ""
CA@13-FB

contempory stories:
ASM @5  battle with Spider-Man
CA@13-FB
SOLOA 6
CA 347 death 
CA@ 13-BTS  post-death story

			*	*	*

Suggestions on Hawkeye & Songbird?
Posted by Russ Chappell on June 10, 2001 at 22:36:19:

Okay, I've just read and analyzed Thunderbolts #50, and I have a 
question about, oddly enough, Hellcat #3.

Wonder Man's presence in Hellcat #3 suggests that Hellcat takes 
place at some point after Maximum Security. With that in mind, does 
anyone have suggestions for the best place to put Hellcat in 
Hawkeye's & Songbird's chronologies?

			*	*	*

Re: Suggestions on Hawkeye & Songbird?
Posted by Masoud on June 11, 2001 at 13:31:10:
In Reply to: Suggestions on Hawkeye & Songbird?
posted by Russ Chappell on June 10, 2001 at 22:36:19:

Not necissarily.  Is there anything that specifically puts it 
after Maximum Security.  It could occur before Wonder Man came 
back to NY and was possessed by Nefaria.  It's reasonable to 
assume he stayed in LA for a little while after the Avengers 
Two mini series to do some work for his second chances foundation.  
Plus Hawkeye isn't wearing the T-Bolts variation of costume 
introduced in TBOLTS 43, which was pretty close to the beginning 
of the Nefatia Protocals crossover when he's fighting Atlas.  Just 
make Hawkeye and Songbird's appearance between TBOLTS 41 and 42 
and Wonder Man's between Avengers Two 3 and Avengers 33 ~ FB (when 
possessed by Nafaria in airport).  

Cheers,
Masoud

			*	*	*

PROJECT PEGASUS
Posted by bradt on June 14, 2001 at 18:48:22:

i'm looking for any info, past and present, regarding "PROJECT 
PEGASUS."  i remember the thing and quasar being involved in it 
back in the lae 70'.  what was it all about...and what's happening 
with it now?

			*	*	*

Re: PROJECT PEGASUS
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 15, 2001 at 00:13:47:
In Reply to: PROJECT PEGASUS
posted by bradt on June 14, 2001 at 18:48:22:

A few facts...

--In the 70s comics you refer to, Quasar was head of Security for 
Project Pegasus.  There were a couple of Marvel Two-In-One issues 
with Thing and Quasar et al.

--At some point, the Serpeant Crown was used in an attack on the 
project, and outside intervention was necessary to save the project. 
Thus, Quasar felt like he wasn't doing his job and quit.

--Years later, Quasar returned to the Project for a visit and 
learned that a new costumed hero, The Blue Shield, had taken his 
place as head of security.

--Quasar repeatedly visited the Project for one reason or another.  
When the Squadron Supreme became stranded on Marvel Earth, he took 
them to Project Pegasus to use the location as a temporary 
headquarters.

--The Squadron became heavily involved in the experiments being 
done at the Project.

--The super powered prison called The Vault began to get crowded, 
so they started sending all "offworld" super powered villains to 
Project: Pegasus.

That's the last I know of the place.  Most of the details above 
came from various issues of the Quasar series in the 90s.

Jimmy

			*	*	*

Also...
Posted by ---- on June 16, 2001 at 10:13:18:
In Reply to: Re: PROJECT PEGASUS
posted by Jimmy Flowers on June 15, 2001 at 00:13:47:

After the Quasar series ended, the Squadron (and by extension 
Pegasus) appeared in Avengers v.3 #5, 6.  That's probably it's 
most recent appearance to date.

			*	*	*

PROJECT PEGASUS
Posted by S.Houston on June 15, 2001 at 04:33:55:

As far as I can remember, the Project Pegasus stories in Marvel 
Two-On-One #52-58, but I think I can remember a brief appearance 
in issue #42.

The project appeared in Marvel Team-up annual 5, and also in a 
few issues of Dazzler, then in Fantastic Four #313, then in various 
issues of quasar.

The project use to house super-powered villains or entities, until 
the VAULT cam along, and took all the interesting characters into 
custody.

I'd have to look up the actual appearances and facts if needed, 
but I think this is enough info to start.

			*	*	*

Kang's Chronology
Posted by Giant Ant on June 17, 2001 at 18:12:53:

I've been trying to make Kang's chronology, and I think you're in 
error on some points.  First of all, you listed Pharaoh Rama-Tut, 
Scarlet Centurion and Kang as different beings, when they are all 
the same man from different points in his life.  When he first 
time-traveled, he took the ID of Rama-Tut. He then flew from the 
FF and became Scarlet Centurion, before changing his name to Kang.  
After a while, he grew tired and took back the Pharaoh's mantle, 
but he eventually became Kang again.  All of this was revealed in 
Avengers Forever 9.

Also, the Scarlet Centurion who appears in Squadron Supreme is one 
from another timeline.<p>So here's what I think is Kang's correct 
chronology.  I just mixed his different IDs appareances, and added 
some issues here and there.  If some of them fall in the gap, sorry.  
It may still contain errors, but it's the best I could do.

Fantastic Four 19 (Flashback)
Rise Of Apocalypse 1-2 (As Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
West Coast Avengers 20-21 (As Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Fantastic Four 19 ~ Dr Strange vol.2 53 ~ West Coast Avengers 22 ~ 
Rise Of Apocalypse 3-4 (As Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Cable vol.2 57 (As Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Fantastic Four Annual 2 (2nd story) (As Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Avengers 56 (Behind the scenes) (As the Scarlet Centurion)
Avengers Annual 2 (As the Scarlet Centurion) 
Captain America Annual 11 (4th story) (Flashback)
Fantastic Four Annual 2
Avengers 8
Avengers Annual 21 (4th story) (Flashback)
Avengers 10 (Behind the scenes)
Thor Annual 17 (4th story) (Flashback)
Avengers Annual 21 (4th story) (Flashback)
Avengers 11
Strange Tales 134
Avengers 16
Avengers Annual 21 (4th story) (Flashback)
Fantastic Four Annual 3
ThunderBolts 13-FB
Avengers 23-24 
Avengers 269 (Flashback)
Thor 140
Thor Annual 17 (4th story) (Flashback)
Avengers 69-71
Thor Annual 17 (4th story) (Flashback)
Hulk vol.2 135
Marvel Team-Up 9-11 (Behind the scenes)
Fantastic Four Annual 25 (5th story) (Flashback)
Avengers 128-129
Giant-Size Avengers 2
Avengers 131-132
Giant-Size Avengers 3
Fantastic Four Annual 25 (5th story) (Flashback)
Giant-Size Avengers 4
Fantastic Four Annual 25 (5th story) (Flashback)
Giant-Size Avengers 4
Avengers 142 (Flashback)
Avengers Forever 4-5
Avengers 141-143
Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars 1-3
Thor 383 (Flashback)
Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars 4
Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars 11
Avengers Annual 21 (4th story) (Flashback)
Avengers 269 (Flashback)
Avengers 267-269
Fantastic Four Annual 25 (5th story) (Flashback)
Avengers Annual 21 (4th story) (Flashback)
Avengers 291(Behind the scenes)
Avengers 292-300
Avengers Annual 21 (4th story) (Flashback)
Captain America Annual 11 (4th story) 
Thor Annual 17 (4th story) 
Fantastic Four Annual 25 (5th story)
Fantastic Four 323-324
Infinity War 1
Infinity War 2
Silver Sable and the Wild Pack 4
Infinity War 2
Infinity War 3 ~ Silver Sable and the Wild Pack 4
Silver Sable and the Wild Pack 4
Infinity War 3
Infinity War 4
Infinity War 4 ~ Silver Sable and the Wild Pack 5
Infinity War 4
Infinity War 4 ~ Silver Sable and the Wild Pack 5
Infinity War 5
Thor Annual 17 (Flashback)
Captain America Annual 11
Thor Annual 17 (Behind the scenes)
Fantastic Four Annual 25 
Avengers Annual 21 
Avengers Annual 21 (4th story)
Avengers : The Terminatrix Objective 1-4
Avengers Forever 9 (Flashback) (Kang switches back to the Pharaoh 
Rama-Tut ID)
Giant-Size Avengers 2 (Flashback) (As Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Fantastic Four Annual 27 (As Pharaoh Rama-Tut) 
Giant-Size Avengers 2 (Flashback) (As Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Avengers West Coast 20
Avengers 129 (as Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Giant-Size Avengers 2 (as Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Avengers 131 (as Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Avengers 132 (as Pharaoh Rama-Tut)
Giant-Size Avengers 3 (as Pharaoh Rama-Tut) 
Avengers Forever 9 (Flashback)
Captain America vol.3 1
Avengers Forever 9 (Flashback)
Avengers Forever 1-3
Avengers Forever 9-12

			*	*	*

Captain America II/Spirit of '76
Posted by Ron F. on June 21, 2001 at 13:23:53:

I would like to submit the following for the second Captain of 
America, which currently does not have any listings:

CAPTAIN AMERICA II/SPIRIT OF '76/WILLIAM NASLAND
INV 14    introduction as Spirit of '76
INV 15    Liberty Legion
CA@ 13    Red Skull bunker scene w/ Cap and Patriot
>WI?  4    becomes Cap II
CA@  6-FB 
WI?  4    dies
CA@  6    meets other Caps after death

			*	*	*

Re: Captain America II/Spirit of '76
Posted by Ron F. on June 27, 2001 at 22:40:32:
In Reply to: Captain America II/Spirit of '76
posted by Ron F. on June 21, 2001 at 13:23:53:

> I would like to submit the following corrections for the second 
Captain America, which currently does not have any listings:

> CAPTAIN AMERICA II/SPIRIT OF '76/WILLIAM NASLUND
> INV 14    introduction as Spirit of '76
> INV 15    Crusaders (not Liberty Legion)
> CA@ 13    Red Skull bunker scene w/Cap &Patriot 
> WI?  4    becomes Cap I
 AllWinners19   GA story in Marvel Universe
> CA@  6-FB 
> WI?  4    dies
> CA@  6    meets other Caps after death  

			*	*	*

comic characters=
Posted by linda edwards on June 22, 2001 at 21:10:15:

i need find out about characters called Hammer_stein and Ro_Jaws

			*	*	*

Re: comic characters
Posted by douglas C on June 24, 2001 at 04:59:38:
In Reply to: comic characters
posted by linda edwards on June 22, 2001 at 21:10:15:

Rojaws and Hammerstein first appeared in the English comic 2000AD, 
in the Robusters stories.  Later on Hammerstein told of his old war 
memories, and the post-war company of robot warriors on Mars called 
the A.B.C. Warriors (also the title of the stories).  In the final 
Robusters story the escaped and wound up on the run.

The both appeared later in Nemesis the Warlock, Rojaws as Nemesis' 
personal valet/butler/hang-around, and Hammerstein (back with his 
old head) was used as a purification robot.  With Nemesis' help 
he was freed from that programming and, along with two new droids - 
Mad Ronn and Hitaki, re-formed the A.B.C. Warriors - this time 
fighting against Torquemada and his Terminators.

			*	*	*

Captain America III/The Patriot
Posted by Ron F. on June 27, 2001 at 22:59:10:

I would like to submit the following for the third Captain America, 
which currently does not have any listings:

CAPTAIN AMERICA/THE PATRIOT/JEFF MACE

As the Patriot:
Marvel Mystery 21  GA intro to the Patriot
M/PRM 29           reintro to the Patriot  
INV  6           Liberty Legion
M/PRM 30             "      "
INV 35             "      "
INV 36             "      "
INV 37             "      "
CA@ 13-FB        Red Skull bunker scene
WI?  4           Patriot becomes Cap III

As Cap III:
WI?  4
All Winners 21     canonical GA story
SHH 22-FB        She Hulk/All-Winners story
CA@ 6-FB        synopsis of career

As retired,aged Patriot:
CA@ 6          dimensional adventure with other Caps
CA 285         dies of cancer

Notes:
1)  The Patriot appeared in the following Golden Age stories:  
Marvel Mystery Comics 21-45, 49-74, and Human Torch Comics 3-4.

2)  All Golden Age stories from Captain America Comics #59 to #74 
have been retroactively edited to feature Jeff Mace as Cap III, 
instead of Steve Rogers. 

			*	*	*

Re: Captain America III/The Patriot
Posted by Giant Ant on July 03, 2001 at 23:35:46:
In Reply to: Captain America III/The Patriot
posted by Ron F. on June 27, 2001 at 22:59:10:

The Patriot also appears in Human Torch Comics 5 (the big HT/Subby 
brawl)
TT

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Re: Captain America III/The Patriot
Posted by Ron Flick on July 04, 2001 at 09:08:21:
In Reply to: Re: Captain America III/The Patriot
posted by Giant Ant on July 03, 2001 at 23:35:46:

Thanks for the info.  I didn't realize he was in that issue.  I 
will have to pull out my copy and look for him.  

Obviously, this appearance would take place between Marvel Mystery 21 
and M/PRM 29.

I also left out his appearance in Invaders (INV)7, immediately 
following M/PRM 30.

Thanks.
Ron

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Human Torch Android
Posted by Ron F. on June 30, 2001 at 10:10:51:

I would like to submit the following expanded chronology for 
Marvel's first superhero, the original Human Torch:

HUMAN TORCH ANDROID/JIM HAMMOND

Marvel Comics  1.......origin 
SAGAHT         1
MarvMystCom 2- 7.......adventures continue
MarvMystCom 8-10.......battle w/SubMariner
SAGAHT         2
MarvMystCom 11--.......adventures continue
HumanTorchCom  1.......first Toro
INV           22.......Toro's origin
SAGAHT         2
HumanTorchCom2-4.......adventures continue
HumanTorchCom  5.......epic battle w/SubMariner
MarvMystComics--.......GA adventures continue
HumanTorchCom 6-.......GA adventures continue
GSINV          1.......origin of Invaders
INV            1.......Invaders series begins
INV            2
INV           31-FB
INV            3
INV            4
INV            5
M/PRM         29
INV            6
M/PRM         30
FF@           11
MTIO@          1-BTS
MTIO          20-BTS
INV            7
INV            8
INV            9
INV           10
INV           11
INV           12
INV           13
INV           14
INV           15
INV@           1
INV           16
INV           17
INV           18
INV           19
INV           20
INV           21
INV           23
INV           24
INV           25
INV           26
INV           27
INV           28
INV           29
INV           30
INV           31
INV           32
INV           33
INV           34
INV           35
INV           36
INV           37
INV           38
INV           39
INV           40
INV           41
SAGAHT         2
INV2           1
INV2           2
INV2           3
INV2           4
CA:SL2         2-FB
CA:SL2         3-FB
CA:SL2         2
CA:SL2         3
CA:SL2         4
DF           2.4
DF           3.6
M/U            1-FB
M/U            1
M/U            2
M/U            3
WI?            4.........with Hitler in bunker
SAGAHT         3
Young Men     24
WI?            4.........transition to All-Winners
All Winners   19.........ISBISA
WI?            4.........Adam-II
All Winners   20.........Future Man
WI?            4
SH2           22-FB......She-Hulk flashback
HumanTorchCom---.........adventures continue
MarvMystComics--.........adventures continue
SunGirl      1-3.........new sidekick series
MarvMystComics92.........last GA story
HumanTorchCom 35.........last GA story
Young Men     24-FB......Crime Syndicate flashback
A            134-FB
Young Men     24.........1950s revival
Young Men  25-28
Men's Adv  27-28
HumanTorchC36-38
CapAmericaC76-78
SubMarinerC33-35
FF@            4-FB......Torch goes nova flahback
A            134-FB
SAGAHT         4

Chronology continues in the Marvel Age with his resurrection in 
Fantastic Four Annual #4.....
FF@            4
Chronology continues as previously outlined.

Note:  
I did not reference Avengers issues 131 and 132, which I do not have.

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Re: Human Torch Android
Posted by Russ Chappell on June 30, 2001 at 17:48:26:
In Reply to: Human Torch Android
posted by Ron F. on June 30, 2001 at 10:10:51:

Thanks, Ron. The Project is woefully inadequate in Golden Age 
chronologies, and your analyses will make this a much stronger 
resource.

> I did not reference Avengers issues 131 and 132, which I do 
not have.

I'll try to get around to posting the details of the Torch's 
appearances above--giving you the opportunity to tell us where 
to place them--but I can't promise when that'll be. If anyone 
out there has the time, it'd be much appreciated here.

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Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
Posted by StAkAr Karnak on July 01, 2001 at 09:18:09:
In Reply to: Re: Human Torch Android
posted by Russ Chappell on June 30, 2001 at 17:48:26:

Russ wrote:
> The Project is woefully inadequate in Golden Age chronologies, 
and your analyses will make this a much stronger resource.

How much of Marvel/Atlas etc. work pre-FF v1 #1 is regarded as 
canon?

- sk

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Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
Posted by Sean Curtin on July 02, 2001 at 16:00:01:
In Reply to: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
posted by StAkAr Karnak on July 01, 2001 at 09:18:09:

How much of Marvel/Atlas etc. work pre-FF v1 #1 is regarded as 
canon?

All of it, really, unless it can't or shouldn't be (like the 
Torch flying to Neptune under his own power, or various racist 
stories that obviously wouldn't be permissible today).

-Sean Curtin

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Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
Posted by Jhaeman on July 02, 2001 at 20:49:06:
In Reply to: Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
posted by Sean Curtin on July 02, 2001 at 16:00:01:

Stuff like that is why I would draw the line at FF #1.  I hate to 
have to put us in a position of saying what is "canon" and what it 
isn't based upon the context of comics whose authors either didn't 
know or didn't care about "continuity."  If, for example, we kicked 
all the stories where superheroes used their powers in conflicting 
or contradictory ways, we'd have to kick most of the Golden Age 
comics and some of the Marvel Age ones as well (such as the issues 
where Namor delivers electric shocks and blows himself up like a 
puffer fish).  If we kicked all Golden Age comics with racist 
comments, we'd lose pretty much all of the WW II issues, (which 
is where Cap, Namor, and the Invaders really shine) because most 
of them involve racist stereotypes of either Japanese or Germans.  
Plus, of course, there is a terrible line-drawing problem of 
deciding "is one racist comment enough?" or "is one racist caricature" 
too much?  And lastly, I'd draw the line at FF # 1 because only a 
terribly small % of people have access to Golden Age comics and only 
an equally small % of comic writers consider them continuity and 
try to conform current plots to them.  We have enough trouble trying 
to chronicle the Marvel Age without adding on the task of sorting 
decades of comics not designed with continuity in mind.

			*	*	*

Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
Posted by Ron F. on July 02, 2001 at 21:19:48:
In Reply to: Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
posted by Jhaeman on July 02, 2001 at 20:49:06:

Thanks for the interest in my post of GA Human Torch.

Concerning the canonicity of Golden Age stories, here is what Mark 
Gruenwald (I believe) said in the letters column of INVADERS 36, 
when asked the same question: 

"Roy [Thomas, editor of the Invaders] does not feel that all 1940's 
amd 1950's pre-Marvel adventures of Cap and company are invalid: 
we've reprinted a tale or two to vouch for its essential accuracy.

"We might allow it to be put this way:  All 1940's amd 1950's stories 
did happen, except where they conflict with stories which have 
appeared (or will appear) in the current Marvel continuity."

This is only a small portion of the answer given in the letters 
column that was published back in 1979. You might like to look it 
up and give it a review.

The way I have tried to approach this is as follows:  Many of the 
early Cap, Subby, and Torch stories have been referenced, refined, 
and incorporated into the canon.  They are essential to each of 
these character's chronologies.  Over the years, Roy Thomas, more 
than anyone, has taken great pains in trying to fuse and synthesize 
these early stories into the Marvel Universe.  Because these re-
tellings  have been published after FF#1, I assume they have to be 
accepted as canon.

Therefore, where do you draw the line?  I say wherever these stories 
have been specifically referenced or alluded to, then they are in.  
I don't think that it is anything so intrinsically difficult to 
determine.  I have spent a good part of the last four or five years 
putting together a detailed chronology of Captain America and have, 
I believe, incorporated all of the Golden Age  stories that have 
been "accepted" as canon.  I will be submitting that post for 
consideration in the next few weeks.   Thanks.

Ron     

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Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
Posted by Jhaeman on July 03, 2001 at 08:55:38:
In Reply to: Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
posted by Ron F. on July 02, 2001 at 21:19:48:

> Therefore, where do you draw the line?  I say wherever these 
stories have been specifically referenced or alluded to, then they 
are in.  

I like that idea a lot!  It seems a good way to place the decision-
making power on the comic writers to decide what's canon and ensures 
that they've thought about the consequences before making it part 
of the Marvel Universe's history.

			*	*	*

Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
Posted by ShadZ on July 24, 2001 at 21:38:00:
In Reply to: Re: Golden Age Marvel (was Re: Human Torch Android)
posted by Ron F. on July 02, 2001 at 21:19:48:

Therefore, where do you draw the line?  I say wherever these stories 
have been specifically referenced or alluded to, then they are in.  
I don't think that it is anything so intrinsically difficult to 
determine.  I have spent a good part of the last four or five years 
putting together a detailed chronology of Captain America and have, 
I believe, incorporated all of the Golden Age  stories that have been 
"accepted" as canon.  I will be submitting that post for consideration 
in the next few weeks.   Thanks.

I believe treating Marvel UK stories in this manner too would make 
sense

ShadZ

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Re: Human Torch Android
Posted by Giant Ant on July 01, 2001 at 22:49:09:
In Reply to: Human Torch Android
posted by Ron F. on June 30, 2001 at 10:10:51:

The Invaders, including HT, also appeared in CLANDESTINE 8, in a 
flashback set in 1944 ("at the end of the war, at Bunbrook"), I don't 
know where it would fit in the list though.  It may also be a book 
from the gap.  If so, sorry.

As for Avengers 131-132 (and also Giant-Size 3), they all fit between 
his death, in SAGAHT 4, and his resurrection, in FF@ 4.  It is said 
that he was taken from the year 1954, so I guess it's right to assume 
that's where the issues fit.

hope that helps
TT

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Re: Human Torch Android
Posted by Ron F. on July 02, 2001 at 20:52:38:
In Reply to: Re: Human Torch Android
posted by Giant Ant on July 01, 2001 at 22:49:09:

> As for Avengers 131-132 (and also Giant-Size 3), they all fit 
between his death, in SAGAHT 4, and his resurrection, in FF@ 4.  
It is said that he was taken from the year 1954, so I guess it's 
right to assume that's where the issues fit.

> hope that helps

It sure does.  Thanks especially for the mention of CLANDESTINE 8.  
I will try to get a copy and work it into the chronology.

Ron

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Re: Human Torch Android
Posted by Nathanael Nerode on June 20, 2002 at 20:20:21:
In Reply to: Re: Human Torch Android
posted by Ron F. on July 02, 2001 at 20:52:38:

I don't know if MARVELS #0 is canonical, but it's a retelling of 
the origin of the original Human Torch, so it might belong up there 
at the top. :-)

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Power Pack / Kazar
Posted by Greg Martin on June 30, 2001 at 10:34:11:

Hey guys,

Site is great.  Quick question, from the gap page, Power Pack 
1 & 2:Peer Pressure, is that the 4 issue limited series Volume 2 
Power pack?  

If so, I can give you an analysis of those 2 comics for you.

Also, I can handle Kazar Vol. 4 #4. 

Will post later today or tomorrow with my power pack results if 
those are the right ones.

Thanks,

Greg

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Re: Power Pack / Kazar
Posted by Russ Chappell on June 30, 2001 at 17:43:47:
In Reply to: Power Pack / Kazar
posted by Greg Martin on June 30, 2001 at 10:34:11:

> Quick question, from the gap page, Power Pack 1 & 2:Peer Pressure, 
is that the 4 issue limited series Volume 2 Power pack?  

I...don't really know. The only Power Pack that I own is the 
sixty-some-odd-issue original run. So if you have any Power Pack 
outside of those that wasn't published in 92-94, we'd be glad to 
hear from you. The Power Pack: Peer Pressure 4-issue limited series 
has been contributed by PaxHouse--I haven't updated the Gap page 
'cause I don't know his real name--but even if it's the same series, 
don't let that deter you from contributing and getting credit for 
confirmation.

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Name that contributor (was Re: Power Pack / Kazar)
Posted by StAkAr Karnak on July 01, 2001 at 09:25:40:
In Reply to: Re: Power Pack / Kazar
posted by Russ Chappell on June 30, 2001 at 17:43:47:

Russ wrote:

> The Power Pack: Peer Pressure 4-issue limited series has been 
contributed by PaxHouse--I haven't updated the Gap page 'cause I 
don't know his real name--

Why is that an issue?  There are plenty of contributors, myself 
included, who prefer pseudonyms, and that has never, to my knowledge, 
been a problem.

- sk, not sure how this comes across, but isn't meant sarcastically...

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Re: Name that contributor (was Re: Power Pack / Kazar)
Posted by Russ Chappell on July 02, 2001 at 23:01:06:
In Reply to: Name that contributor (was Re: Power Pack / Kazar)
posted by StAkAr Karnak on July 01, 2001 at 09:25:40:

> Why is that an issue?  There are plenty of contributors, myself 
included, who prefer pseudonyms, and that has never, to my knowledge, 
been a problem.

It's not a problem, per se. We've given PaxHouse credit on the 
Updates page. Whereas you, StAkAr, have an identity here, and on 
usenet, and on your own sites, I'm just not personally familiar 
yet with PaxHouse. Until he or she becomes more of a presence here, 
either by public postings or private email, anyone can claim to be 
PaxHouse.

It becomes a little bit more of a quandary for me when someone I 
don't know uses a pseudonym in an email contribution. Let's say 
I get an email from peterparker@aol.com, providing an analysis of 
Avengers #1. How do I identify him on the Updates page? The email 
was in essense private communication, so I don't have the right 
to reveal his email address. And I'm not going to say, "Thanks 
to Peter Parker for contributing an analysis." I'm just not.

So here's my proposal: If you
a) send updates or corrections by private email, and
b) wish to receive credit for the contribution, and
c) use a pseudonym rather than your real name, then:
include permission in the email for me to post your email address 
on the Updates page.

I'll add this to the FAQ.

			*	*	*

Re: Name that contributor (was Re: Power Pack / Kazar)
Posted by PaxHouse on July 24, 2001 at 12:05:18:
In Reply to: Re: Name that contributor (was Re: Power Pack / Kazar)
posted by Russ Chappell on July 02, 2001 at 23:01:06:

It's my handle actually. Oh, and my apologies for not responsing 
any sooner. It's just that I've got an extremely busy schedule 
during the summer.

Those are great points you've made there. And if you're still 
wondering about the confusion; THE POWER PACK: PEER PRESSURE 4 
Issue Mini is REALLY the Second Volume Mini, due to the decision 
of the previous Editor-In-Chief who's responsible for those changes 
(Bob Harras)...

PaxHouse.

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Re: Power Pack / Kazar
Posted by Randy Tischler on July 02, 2001 at 15:48:09:
In Reply to: Power Pack / Kazar
posted by Greg Martin on June 30, 2001 at 10:34:11:

> Quick question, from the gap page, Power Pack 1 & 2:Peer Pressure, 
is that the 4 issue limited series Volume 2 Power pack?  

I'm almost positive the 2nd volume of Power Pack (the 4-part LS from 
last year or so) was supposed to be called Peer Pressure.  I don't 
think they titled the comics that way when they released them 
ultimately.

Randy

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Re: Power Pack
Posted by MyWords on July 24, 2001 at 01:02:17:
In Reply to: Re: Power Pack / Kazar
posted by Randy Tischler on July 02, 2001 at 15:48:09:

> I'm almost positive the 2nd volume of Power Pack (the 4-part LS 
from last year or so) was supposed to be called Peer Pressure.  I 
don't think they titled the comics that way when they released them 
ultimately.

You are correct, sir! "Peer Pressure" appears no where in the 
issues (cover, indicia, splash page or otherwise).

MyWords

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Wraith I appearances post-ASM #278?
Posted by Gary M. Miller on June 30, 2001 at 18:18:48:

Hey all,

I know the issue(s) in question are probably somewhere in the gap, 
but I'm curious, I have heard Brian DeWolff, AKA the Wraith, is 
still alive after his "death" in ASM #278, he's the head of some 
vampire cult....but where is this seen?  I'd appreciate an answer 
ASAP....in return, I'll likely throw in a few fixes for characters 
in this site....

Thanks in advance,

-Gary M.

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Re: Wraith I appearances post-ASM #278?
Posted by Don Campbell on July 01, 2001 at 09:25:27:
In Reply to: Wraith I appearances post-ASM #278?
posted by Gary M. Miller on June 30, 2001 at 18:18:48:

I believe that Brian DeWolff appeared somewhere in the MORBIUS 
series.  I think that it was a two-issue story but I haven't don't 
remember which issues except that it was after #16 and before any 
of the stories written by the last writer on the series.  What I 
do recall is that, after he was killed in ASM #278, it was Brian's 
mental powers that enabled his consciousness to occupy and take 
over another person's living body but the experience seemed to 
have driven him somewhat insane.  I think that Brian's new body 
died during his encounter with Morbius but I don't remember if 
there was any sign that his soul survived yet again.

Sorry I couldn't be more help.

Don Campbell

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Re: Wraith I appearances post-ASM #278?
Posted by Michel Racaud on July 01, 2001 at 10:52:42:
In Reply to: Re: Wraith I appearances post-ASM #278?
posted by Don Campbell on July 01, 2001 at 09:25:27:

> I believe that Brian DeWolff appeared somewhere in the MORBIUS 
series.  I think that it was a two-issue story but I haven't don't 
remember which issues except that it was after #16 and before any 
of the stories written by the last writer on the series. 

Well remembered, Don :-)) It was #18-19, a two-part story with 
Deathlok

>What I do recall is that, after he was killed in ASM #278, it 
was Brian's mental powers that enabled his consciousness to occupy 
and take over another person's living body but the experience seemed 
to have driven him somewhat insane.  I think that Brian's new body 
died during his encounter with Morbius but I don't remember if 
there was any sign that his soul survived yet again.

I don't remember any other appearance. Morbius drinks his blood at 
the end of the story, but since he had "transcended death thanks 
to his psionic powers" once, he surely can do it again :-)

Michel

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