MR. SINISTER...N'GASSI...DR. ARTHUR NAGAN
Posted by Arthur Stein on May 01, 2003 at 16:05:22:

new entries marked **

MR. SINISTER/NATHAN ESSEX
XF 39-FB
M/GN 17-FB ~ UX 376-FB
**CX 41/1  (I do not have CX 42, so I am really just presuming that CX 41/2 precedes it)
CX 42/2

N'GASSI
**BP 6
BP 7
BP 8

NAGAN, DR. ARTHUR
DEF@ 1
**PM&IF 68
S-H2 1

Note to newcomers. Just to explain what my postings areas an avid Marvelist I had my own version of this Marvel Chronology Project (MCP). I am now comparing the two, and for all character entries in the MCP, I am checking if I have any appearances that may have been overlooked. Validating them. Chronologizing them. Posting them (so others have an opportunity to refute or comment). The aim... to help in the completeness of this magnificent piece of information engineering!

#84

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New Mutants: Truth or Death placement suggestion
Posted by Jeph! on May 02, 2003 at 14:18:31:

The current placement of the "New Mutants: Truth or Death" series has been bothering me for some time, but until recently I couldn't sit down and work out a better placement.  I finally found the time, and I believe I now have a much better placement.  let me know what you think.

This three-issue series reunites the five original New Mutants  Cannonball, Sunspot, Karma, Moonstar, and Wolfsbane (plus Douglock)  for a weekend at the mansion, where they find themselves battling Mikhail Rasputin and their time-travelling past selves.  This series was published around the time that "Operation: Zero Tolerance" was wrapping up, and that's where it's been placed  between X-Men #71-72, and between X-Force #70-71.

The trouble with this placement is, at that time (from X-Men #70-81), the X-Mansion had been stripped.  Of everything.  Shi'Ar technology, personal effects, furniture  all gone.  The mansion was reduced to bare wood walls and floors, thanks to Bastion, who gained control of the mansion in Cable v2 #47.  By the time of X #73, the X-Men have replaced some of the effects (kitchen table, TV, couch, wallpaper), but the Shi'Ar medical technology and Danger Room are still missing even as of X #81.

In the NM:TOD series, though, the mansion is depicted as perfectly normal  several characters' rooms are shown fully furnished, team photographs hang everywhere, genetic identity scanners and holding cells complete with energy barriers are used, and the Shi'Ar medlab is given heavy use.  We also see the Danger Room.  There's no way that the TOD series could occur where it is currently placed.

Could the series, then, occur after X #81, where the X-Men are shown starting to rebuild the Danger Room?  No  the events of TOD are referenced in X-Force #75, which takes place between X #73-74.  Meaning, the TOD series must also take place prior to X #74.  And therefore, prior to X #70, since the mansion is unuseable between X #70-74.

Now, from X #62-70, Cannonball is either out of the country or a prisoner of O:ZT.  There are no opportunities for him to appear in the TOD series during X #62-70, and by X #70, the mansion has been stripped.  Therefore, the TOD series must occur before X #62.

How does this work out for the other characters?  Well, we only have a solid departure point from two of them  Wolfsbane and Douglock.  In Excalibur #113, Rahne departs for the reunion, and Moira warns her to lay low, citing the fuss O:ZT is currently kicking up in the USA.  (More evidence that the series can't take place where it's currently located, as O:ZT was shut down in X #69.)  In Excalibur #114, Douglock decides to join her, and jumps ship for the airport, hoping to catch Rahne's flight.  (Which he does, as we see in TOD #1.)

Now, at the very end of EXCAL #114, Moira MacTaggert receives an urgent e-mail from SHIELD, who then show up to pick up Shadowcat in "Kitty Pryde: Agent of SHIELD" #1.  In KP:AOS #1, when SHIELD arrives, Wolfsbane and Douglock are back on the island  meaning, there must be a gap somewhere long enough to accommodate a weekend in the States.  It seems unlikely that SHIELD would notify Moira several days before they were due to arrive  especially given the nature of their emergency, and the fact that everyone else on the island seemed surprised at their arrival  so the gap must be in EXCAL #114 itself.  I have found a likely one between pp.13-14.  Kitty is down in the tunnels below Muir searching for Lockheed during the entire issue, but it's very easily assumed that she made more than one trip to search for him  he'd been missing for weeks at that point anyway.  Other than Kitty in the tunnels, the gap between pp.13-14 could easily span any length of time.

So: Wolfsbane and Douglock appear between pp.13-14 of EXCAL #114, where there exists a gap of  according to the TOD series  at least 2-3 days.  What about everyone else?

Karma is not a problem  she was last seen in the Beast limited series, which occurs between UX #340-341  and UX #341, featuring Cannonball, occurs before he travels to Hong Kong in X #62.  Therefore, we've actually narrowed the gap down  the TOD series has to occur AFTER the Beast series, meaning in-between UX #340 and X #62.

(Narrowing further  UX #340 occurs before Graydon Creed's death in X-Factor #130.  At that time, Cannonball is undercover in Creed's campaign.  He remains undercover during X #60-61, which take place shortly AFTER Creed's death.  And in X #62 he leaves for Hong Kong.  Therefore, the TOD series has to occur between X #61-62.)

Sunspot is not a problem either  he's a regularly featured character in X-Force, and plenty of opportunities can be found for him to slip away.

Moonstar  ahh, Moonstar is a problem.  At that time, she is an undercover member of the MLF  she has been since X-Force #28 or so --  and she doesn't break cover and rejoin the team until X-Force #67-70, a story arc that ends with them meeting Cable, who tells them the mansion has been compromised  therefore, too late for the TOD series to take place.  There are no gaps in that storyline  but is there an earlier point at which Dani could have snuck away from the MLF and enjoyed a weekend with her old teammates?

Yes  yes there is.  In the "X-Force and Cable" 1997 Annual, Dani is alerted to a threat to the Asgardian Valkyrior, and calls in X-Force to help her out.  She tells Forearm of the MLF that she's going away for personal business.  This is an IDEAL time for her to take a weekend detour to the X-Mansion.  At the end of the annual, as X-Force stands on a windswept Asgardian plain, Dani says that she won't be returning home with them; that Brunnhilda will take her back to the MLF.  However, we never see her actually LEAVE, we never see her separate from her former teammates and start to walk away.  It's entirely possible that, seconds after the issue ends, Sunspot gets her to change her mind, and at least attend the reunion.  (More to the point, we HAVE to assume he convinces her, because there's no other way for Dani to be available for the TOD series.)

Now, this is a fairly spotty period for the MCP  it's in the middle of the second gap.  So far I've been able to deduce that XFO@'97 is currently placed between XFO #62 and #69, but no more.  I'll try to narrow it down further  and see if it can be placed in a proper spot to allow it to be a day or two before the TOD series. 

Now, X-Force #62 occurs before the Beast limited series  Karma's siblings being kidnapped by Spiral in this issue is the set-up for that series.  Since the Beast series takes place before the TOD series, the X-Force Annual should take place after XFO #62.  In X-Force #65, Caliban begins to suffer seizures  and he is healthy in the X-Force annual.  Therefore, the annual takes place between XFO #62-65  and #63-64 are a two-part story in Latveria.  At the very end of that story, X-Force says that they've contacted "the X-Men at the mansion".  Now, in UX #341, half of the X-Men are whisked away to Shi'Ar space, and in X #62, the other half go to Hong Kong.  Neither group returns to the mansion until X #70, and in-between the only X-Men at the mansion are Archangel and Psylocke.

Therefore, it's likely that XFO #63-64 take place at LEAST before X #62.  However, there's no way to place it any more accurately  and the TOD series (and therefore the X-Force annual) takes place before X #62 as well.  So I'll just shrug, go with the relative publication order of the two, and say that the annual takes place just after XFO #64.

Therefore, for Sunspot and Moonstar, the NM:TOD series can take place between XFO@'97 and XFO #65.

Now, for Wolfsbane and Douglock, whose appearances are tied into Excalibur continuity at a definite point  can we shift EXCAL #114 backwards, claiming it takes place between X #61-62 and XFO #64-65?  Can we say that EXCAL #114 takes place before the entire Operation: Zero Tolerence crossover?

Excalibur #115 takes place just after Gen-X #33; Banshee is on Muir Island for both issues.  Gen-X #32-33 take place AFTER their portion of the O:ZT crossover  therefore Excalibur #115 takes place after O:ZT as well.  However, the gap I created in Excalibur #114 pp.13-14 is of sufficient vagueness that it probably CAN be widened to hold all of X #62-69.  Those issues probably take a week at most, and there's no fast-paced stories going on at the time in Excalibur  it's workable.

Now, Rory Campbell appears in X #63, where it is revealed to the readers that he's been working for Sebastian Shaw.  He appears again in EXCAL #111, where it's clear that Moira knows that he's working for Shaw.  However, in X #63, none of the X-MEN learn that Rory is working for Shaw  only the reader learns this.  Therefore, Moira must have learned of Rory's allegiances through a different method, and this is NOT proof that EXCAL #111 has to come after X #63.

Excalibur #107-110, based on Spiral's appearances, take place after the Beast miniseries  and in #110, Moira receives an e-mail from Alistauire Stuart, saying that he was taking Rory to Japan to be fitted for a prosthetic leg (placing EXCAL #110 before X #63  and perhaps THIS is how Moira learned of his allegiances?)  so already, EXCAL #107-110 are placed between BEAST #1-3 and X #62-64.  It doesn't seem like much of a stretch at all to go ahead and place EXCAL #111-114 p.13 into the same gap (along with the Colossus one-shot, which takes place between EXCAL #112-113).  The only major change would be the flipping of X #62 and EXCAL #111 in Rory Campbell's chronology.

One other plot point  Dani Moonstar doesn't tell X-Force that she's UNDERCOVER until XFO #67  until then, they all believe she's really joined the MLF.  Sunspot in particular is very mad at her for withholding this information.  However, in the TOD series, Cannonball knows that she's undercover, and she freely tells her past self this information.  Although the TOD series was clearly WRITTEN to take place after Dani rejoined X-Force, it can be made to work where I've placed it with the following rationale: Dani confided in Cannonball, and ONLY in him, because he told her about HIS recent undercover stint in Graydon Creed's campaign (which ended only recently, in X #61).  However, even though they shared a common espionage experience, she made him promise not to tell anyone else.  (And telling her past self isn't really a problem either, as long as she made her promise not to blab it around too.)

So: to sum up  the "New Mutants: Truth or Death" series can and would work MUCH better placed between X #61-62, UX #340-341, XFO@'97-XFO #65, and EXCAL #114 pp.13-14, than its current MCP placement.

Can anyone see any holes in this suggestion?  Any logic traps or irreconcilable character appearances I missed?  Any input on this  even confirmation  would be very welcome.

-Jeph!

Revised placement:

UX #340
XF #130
XFO #62
X #60-61
BEAST #1-3
EXCAL #107-110
XFO #63-64
X@'97
EXCAL #111-112
COLOSSUS
XFO@'97
EXCAL #113
EXCAL #114 pp.1-13
NM:TOD #1-3
UX #341
X #62-65
C2 #47
XFO #67-70
X #66-70


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Re: New Mutants: Truth or Death placement suggestion
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 02, 2003 at 19:36:49:
In Reply to: New Mutants: Truth or Death placement suggestion
posted by Jeph! on May 02, 2003 at 14:18:31:

> Can anyone see any holes in this suggestion?  Any logic traps or irreconcilable character appearances I missed?  Any input on this  even confirmation  would be very welcome.

Jeph, I have to hand it to you.  I'm impressed with this thoughtful analysis and am inclined to go along with your logic.  Your review is so thorough, I don't see the need for me to go double-checking things.  Well done, I say!

--Paul

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Re: New Mutants: Truth or Death placement suggestion
Posted by Jeph! on May 04, 2003 at 01:59:26:
In Reply to: Re: New Mutants: Truth or Death placement suggestion
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 02, 2003 at 19:36:49:

Thank you, Paul!  I really appreciate that.  A lot of work and fact-checking went into this and it's great to get positive feedback.  Thanks very much!

-Jeph!

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Little errors
Posted by Jopili on May 03, 2003 at 03:20:30:

In:
TIMBERIUS
Amazing Adventures = there is 'AA2' instead of 'AAD2'
in:
ZURAS
What If? = there is 'WI' instead of 'WI?'

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X-Men 2 - the movie
Posted by Ross Snyder on May 04, 2003 at 01:17:02:

I was somewhat surprised to see that William Stryker doesn't appear in the MCP - is there a character analagous to him in the Marvel Universe, and they just changed the name for the movie?  I don't have _God Loves, Man Kills_ (which I understand the movie is loosely based on) and am not as up on my X-Men history as I should be.

Ross

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Re: X-Men 2 - the movie
Posted by Jeph! on May 04, 2003 at 01:24:15:
In Reply to: X-Men 2 - the movie
posted by Ross Snyder on May 04, 2003 at 01:17:02:

> I was somewhat surprised to see that William Stryker doesn't appear in the MCP

You're right.  That's ...weird.

> is there a character analagous to him in the Marvel Universe, and they just changed the name for the movie?

As far as I can remember, the character's name is Reverend William Stryker.  His one and only appearance is in the "God Loves, Man Kills" graphic novel.

I should say, his one and only appearance CURRENTLY -- this coming Wednesday, he makes his second appearance in X-Treme X-Men #25, being brought back to coincide with the release of X2...

I'm surprised he's not on the MCP (unless he's been mis-filed somewhere), but seeing as he's about to show up in more comics, rest assured he'll be added in.

-Jeph!

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Haunt of Horror, Gabriel, Satana; and Marduk Kurios!
Posted by Gary M. Miller on May 04, 2003 at 23:23:47:

Hi all--

A nod to the administrator(s): it seems you guys are missing info for all but one issue of HAUNT OF HORROR, the 70s magazine (which, it should probably be noted, is actually volume 2 of said series, the first of which was a digest that ran two issues--yes, from Marvel as well back in '73!).  I'm still feeling things out myself--I hope to have the remaining holes in my collection plugged in about 2 weeks--but I have to say that Gabriel Rosetti appeared in HOH2 (yup, note change of volume number) 3, 4, and 5; also, Satana did appear in #s 4 and 5.  Not to worry, I'll chrnologize soon as I get the issues in question, and post to this board.  Did you know these books even existed?

Oh yeah, before I forget: Satan I should also be listed as MARDUK KURIOS--note the 'k' at the end of the first name, which is curiously omitted from the name in the listings for "S"...

Also--no, I haven't forgotten--the Master of Kung-Fu-related chronology is forthcoming, changes and all (and there appear to be plenty!) since I obtained all necessary issues of DHKF magazine.

Cheers!

-Gary

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X-Tinction Agenda Parts 8 and 9
Posted by Jhaeman on May 05, 2003 at 10:50:05:

While re-reading my X-Men collection, I realize I have parts 1-7 of the X-Tinction Agenda but are missing the two final issues.  I hate not knowing endings to stories :)  So what happens to Cameron Hodge and Genosha?

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Re: X-Tinction Agenda Parts 8 and 9 (SPOILERS)
Posted by Iain on May 07, 2003 at 05:30:50:
In Reply to: X-Tinction Agenda Parts 8 and 9
posted by Jhaeman on May 05, 2003 at 10:50:05:

> While re-reading my X-Men collection, I realize I have parts 1-7 of the X-Tinction Agenda but are missing the two final issues.  I hate not knowing endings to stories :)  So what happens to Cameron Hodge and Genosha?

There's a all out battle where Hodge takes on various groups of X-Men, X-Factor and the New Mutants. Both issues continue the trend of this crossover by having much poorer art than the 'UNCANNY' issues, and the numerous mutants all struggle for space and panel time. 

Continuing where Part 7 left off, the heroes battle Hodge until an explosion rocks the Citadel. This forces Hodge to panic and he retreats by phasing through the floor. All the captive mutants have their powers restored by Storm. The mutants form an uneasy truce with Magistrate Anderson, who realises Hodge is out to destroy Genosha as well as the X-Men.

Splitting the mutants into smaller groups Cyclops orders some to find Rahne while the rest concentrate on finding Hodge. Cyclops grimly orders the heroes to do whatever neccessary to get through his traitorous brother, Havok, in order to finally beat Hodge...

Jubilee, Boom-Boom, Rictor and Rahne regroup with their team-mates and have thier powers restored. Rahne's powers are altered so that in her werewolf form she's bigger and can think. She can never return to her full human form ever again though, or she'll revert to her mutate state.

Elsewhere Havok survives the explosions that rock through The Citadel, and removes the power dampener he'd been forced to wear. He intends to keep up the pretense of being a loyal Magistrate long enough to get close to Hodge and 'melt him into slag'...

The Genegineer leads a small group of heroes to Hodges lab and advise them to destroy it to lure Hodge to them. This works and after a fierce battle Hodge retreats further into The Citadel, but not before snapping the neck of the Genegineer, who dies fighting alongside the X-men. 

The heroes now ready themselves for the final showdown...

Part 9 is the climatic end batle against Hodge. In an all out fight with the mutants Hodge finally begins to take some damage.

Firstly his phasing unit is destroyed by Archangel, and Hodge is anchored to the walls he was trying to phase through. 

Havok joins the fight and barrages Hodge with his plasma blasts, but again this has little effect. Cyclops, Marvel Girl, Havok and Wolverine now close in for the kill...

Elsewhere in the Citadel Beast tries to get his wounded comrades to  safety. He's helped by the New Mutants. As they leave they bump into Anderson who has began a coup and holds the female president at gun point.

Meanwhile the battle with hodge has reached the very roof of the Citadel and only Havok and Cyclops are left fit enough to confront him. Joining hands they blast Hodge with everything they've got. They pound on Hodge until he's nothing but a head with wires sticking out, but he still won't die. 

Finally his head topples from the Citadel, falls 160 stories and lands at Rahnes feet. But it's still not dead. She rips it up and flings it away in anger and Rictor topples the whole Citadel on top of it. 

Cutting to 'several days later' a television broadcast shows Anderson announcing that Genosha is under temporary martial law. Havok agrees to stay to ensure mutants and mutates will be treated fairly under the new regime. 

Rahne also makes the shock announcement that she will stay, feeling, as a mutate, she should do what she can to help them. She says her goodbyes to her team mates and gives them Warlocks ashes to sprinkle on Doug Ramsey's grave.

Finally, it cuts to Warlock's funeral and they scatter the ashes onto Doug's grave. 

As the heroes depart they reflect on the battle: 'a country has been saved from slavery, but a terrible cost'.  

In the final panel light sparkles on the ashes, 'is it merely sunlight glinting on metallic dust... or the promise of something more?'

This hint led to fans requesting Doug and Warlock's return as a combined being, and eventually Douglock was introduced. And quickly withdrawn.

Rahne and Havok continued to work in Genosha until X-Factor #71 when they both helped found the new U.S. Government backed X-Factor. 

Returning to Westchester the X-Men were whipped off into space, the New Mutants changed into X-Force and X-Factor soon re-joined the X-Men under the original founder Professor Charles Xavier.   

Hope this helped. 

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Re: X-Tinction Agenda Parts 8 and 9 (SPOILERS)
Posted by Jhaeman on May 07, 2003 at 10:26:45:
In Reply to: Re: X-Tinction Agenda Parts 8 and 9 (SPOILERS)
posted by Iain on May 07, 2003 at 05:30:50:

>  Hope this helped. 

Very much so!  Thanks!

Jhaeman

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NAZE...ROMAN NEKOBAH...FRANKLIN &quot;FOGGY&quot; NELSON
Posted by Arthur Stein on May 05, 2003 at 17:07:18:

new entries marked **

NAZE
I do not understand why UX 222 and UX 223 are listed under Naze, but not the other issues where the Adversary has taken Nazes form. 
Now to be honest I never fully understood what went down with Naze; I was always unsure of whether The Adversary replaced Naze or possessed him or ?, but if replaced, then NONE of the Adversary issues should be listed under Naze, and if possessed, then ALL of them should be listed under Naze.  
Additionally, I thought that Naze was himself for most of issue UX 187 (having thoughts -not speech - about his foster son, and all too human thoughts like ah, to be twenty years younger); then hes taken by the Dire Wraith somewhere between pgs 12 and 19. And then in UX 188 the Adversary takes control.  Maybe.

I could easily be dissuaded. :)

Anyway.
NAZE
UX 262-FB
UX 184
**UX 187
UX 222  (???)
UX 223  (???)

ADVERSARY
(removing UX 187)
UX 188
UX 220
UX 221
UX 222
UX 223
UX 224
UX 225
UX 226
UX 227

NEKOBAH, ROMAN
(Im not seeing Roman Nekobah in DAZZ 32
DAZZ 33
**DAZZ 34
M/GN 12

NELSON, FRANKLIN "FOGGY"
DD 46
**DD 47  (unnamed  Pg 12/2 sitting as co-counsel in court); no idea if this should be before or after ASM 65. I placed it before because of Foggys reference in ASM 65 to the elections and then a few days later in DD 48 the elections happen. So I kept those two together. No other reason.
ASM 65
DD 48
..  ..  ..  ..   ..
DD 86
**DD 87
DD 108
..  ..  ..  ..   ..
DD 149
**DD 150    Foggys voice is heard when he phones Matt on Pg 14
DD 151

Note to newcomers. Just to explain what my postings areas an avid Marvelist I had my own version of this Marvel Chronology Project (MCP). I am now comparing the two, and for all character entries in the MCP, I am checking if I have any appearances that may have been overlooked. Validating them. Chronologizing them. Posting them (so others have an opportunity to refute or comment). The aim... to help in the completeness of this magnificent piece of information engineering! 

#86

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Captain Britain, Psylocke and continuity. Please Help.
Posted by Iain on May 07, 2003 at 06:10:32:

I've recently re read the 'Acts of Venegeance'issues of Uncanny X-Men (#256-258) and I was wondering about a few things. 

In #256 Psylocke undergoes a brutal brainwashing and conditioning regime at the hands of the Mandarin. During her hallucinations and weird dream sequences she summons up the villain SLAYMASTER. The dialogue hints at an eventful history between them, and also verifies the villain is dead.

I was interested in finding out more about SLAYMASTER, and reading the issues where he battles Psylocke. It's here that I encountered a problem.

Firstly, as this is only a hallucination #256 doesn't count as an appearance. This meant he wasn't listed in my X-Men index, so I couldn't find out his previous or next appearance. 

I then tried this chronology site, which has always been indispensable in the past. It only lists one set of appearances for SLAYMASTER. It appears to be a back up story in a British comic SUPER SPIDER-MAN AND CAPTAIN BRITAIN #243-247. I figured that means he's introduced and killed in one story, but still does enough to warrant his prescence in Uncanny #256. 

Cross referencing this with Captain Britain and Psylocke's lists I found Psylocke only appears in the very first part of this story but Captain Britain is in all 5. 

This story takes place just before Captain Britain's big stateside appearances alongside Spider-man in Marvel Team Up, and before his run in the British Hulk comic. It also seems to be Psylockes last appearance alongside her brother, before she starts to become a regular around the X titles. 

I live in England, and I can't find any retailers that even list that Super Spider-man comic, and I can't find any record of it being reprinted for the American market, or these stories being collected elsewhere. 

Does any one out there know where I can find more info on Slaymaster? Has anyone even read these British issues? 

UNCANNY X-MEN was the biggest selling comic of it's time when this ACTS OF VENEGEANCE story was printed, and I can't believe such a pivotal appearance by this character would go unmentioned at the time.

I even looked through later issues of UNCANNY to see if any readers at the time had mentioned him but no letter columns were compiled about those issues.  

Practically no one would have even known who SLAYMASTER was, or what he did to Betsy when this issue was published, but the editors and creative team still included him as the climax of #256. 

Someone out there must know something about this guy and his past. Any information anybody has I'd be happy to receive it.   

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Re: Captain Britain, Psylocke and continuity. Please Help.
Posted by Jhaeman on May 07, 2003 at 10:31:45:
In Reply to: Captain Britain, Psylocke and continuity. Please Help.
posted by Iain on May 07, 2003 at 06:10:32:

>  Someone out there must know something about this guy and his past. Any information anybody has I'd be happy to receive it.   

There's a profile and description of Slaymaster's powers at the following link:  http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/slaymast.htm

Jhaeman

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About Slaymaster...
Posted by Jeph! on May 07, 2003 at 12:43:53:
In Reply to: Captain Britain, Psylocke and continuity. Please Help.
posted by Iain on May 07, 2003 at 06:10:32:

Hrmm.  Well.  I suppose that's my fault, then.

Slaymaster's had a few other appearances besides the "Super Spider-Man" back-up -- and it's THOSE appearances where his involvement with Psylocke comes in.  However, they're not on the MCP ... yet.

And since I've been the self-proclaimed Captain Britain fan, taking it upon myself to slowly submit all of his UK appearances to the MCP, you can blame me for not working fast enough if you'd like.

In any case, Slaymaster also appears in:

The Daredevils #3, 4
Mighty World of Marvel #16
Captain Britain v2 #2, 3, 13

All of these issues, by the way, can be found collected (and in color!) in the two "Captain Britain" TPBs -- one from 2002 by Alan Moore and Alan Davis, and the other from 1988 by Jamie Delano and Alan Davis.

Additionally, DDS #3-4 are collected in "X-Men Archives featuring Captain Britain" #3.

In the DDS issues, he kills all of Psylocke's telepathic friends, causing her severe mental pain.  In CB2 #13, Psylocke herself has taken up the mantle of Captain Britain, and battles Slaymaster -- he defeats her easily, and gouges her eyes out with his fingers!  When Brian finds out, he goes after Slaymaster and kills him, smashing his head in with a boulder.

This storyline is Psylocke's last UK appearance -- she then showed up in Uncanny X-Men Annual #10, getting captured by Mojo and having bionic eyes implanted...

Hope that helped.  And thanks for the unwitting kick in the pants -- I'll try to get back to writing up these UK books.  Grr.

-Jeph!

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Speaking of the Captain Britian Reprints
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 07, 2003 at 13:54:17:
In Reply to: About Slaymaster...
posted by Jeph! on May 07, 2003 at 12:43:53:

> All of these issues, by the way, can be found collected (and in color!) in the two "Captain Britain" TPBs -- one from 2002 by Alan Moore and Alan Davis, and the other from 1988 by Jamie Delano and Alan Davis.

> Additionally, DDS #3-4 are collected in "X-Men Archives featuring Captain Britain" #3.

How much (if any) overlap is there among these reprints.

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Re: Speaking of the Captain Britian Reprints
Posted by Jeph! on May 07, 2003 at 15:27:16:
In Reply to: Speaking of the Captain Britian Reprints
posted by Andy Holcombe on May 07, 2003 at 13:54:17:

> > All of these issues, by the way, can be found collected (and in color!) in the two "Captain Britain" TPBs -- one from 2002 by Alan Moore and Alan Davis, and the other from 1988 by Jamie Delano and Alan Davis.

> > Additionally, DDS #3-4 are collected in "X-Men Archives featuring Captain Britain" #3.

> How much (if any) overlap is there among these reprints.

Quite a bit, actually.

The "X-Men Archives featuring Captain Britain" 7-issue series collects all of CB's UK appearances from "Marvel Super-Heroes Magazine" #377 to "Mighty World of Marvel" #13.

The 2002 "Captain Britain" TPB, in turn, collects "X-Men Archives" #3-7 in their entirety, plus about half of issue #2.

The 1988 "Captain Britain" TPB collects "Mighty World of Marvel" #14-16 and "Captain Britain" v2 #1-14.  It picks up right where "X-Men Archives" #7 and the 2002 CB TPB left off, with NO overlap.

To have a full-color reprint of Alan Davis' run on CB's various UK books, you only need to own "X-Men Archives" #1-2 and both "Captain Britain" TPBs.

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Oh, and a question of my own...
Posted by Jeph! on May 07, 2003 at 15:29:43:
In Reply to: Re: Speaking of the Captain Britian Reprints
posted by Jeph! on May 07, 2003 at 15:27:16:

> To have a full-color reprint of Alan Davis' run on CB's various UK books, you only need to own "X-Men Archives" #1-2 and both "Captain Britain" TPBs.

That's not entirely true -- both "X-Men Archives" #4 and the 2002 "Captain Britain" TPB accidentally left a single page out -- the same one both times, from "The Daredevils" #6.

I've been told that the second printing of the 2002 CB TPB will correct this problem, but I have no idea if it's even come out yet.  Does anyone know if the second printing of this book has been released?

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Re: Speaking of the Captain Britian Reprints
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 07, 2003 at 18:28:02:
In Reply to: Re: Speaking of the Captain Britian Reprints
posted by Jeph! on May 07, 2003 at 15:27:16:

> To have a full-color reprint of Alan Davis' run on CB's various UK books, you only need to own "X-Men Archives" #1-2 and both "Captain Britain" TPBs.

Thanks a bunch.  I already had the X-Men Archives series, but I didn't know what the first Captain Britian TPB reprinted. I knew the second trade picked up sometime during the Archives run, but I didn't know where it stopped.

			*	*	*

Re: About Slaymaster...
Posted by Iain on May 08, 2003 at 04:10:43:
In Reply to: About Slaymaster...
posted by Jeph! on May 07, 2003 at 12:43:53:

> Hrmm.  Well.  I suppose that's my fault, then.

> Slaymaster's had a few other appearances besides the "Super Spider-Man" back-up -- and it's THOSE appearances where his involvement with Psylocke comes in.  However, they're not on the MCP ... yet.

> And since I've been the self-proclaimed Captain Britain fan, taking it upon myself to slowly submit all of his UK appearances to the MCP, you can blame me for not working fast enough if you'd like.

> In any case, Slaymaster also appears in:

> The Daredevils #3, 4<br>> Mighty World of Marvel #16

> Captain Britain v2 #2, 3, 13

> All of these issues, by the way, can be found collected (and in color!) in the two "Captain Britain" TPBs -- one from 2002 by Alan Moore and Alan Davis, and the other from 1988 by Jamie Delano and Alan Davis.

> Additionally, DDS #3-4 are collected in "X-Men Archives featuring Captain Britain" #3.

> In the DDS issues, he kills all of Psylocke's telepathic friends, causing her severe mental pain.  In CB2 #13, Psylocke herself has taken up the mantle of Captain Britain, and battles Slaymaster -- he defeats her easily, and gouges her eyes out with his fingers!  When Brian finds out, he goes after Slaymaster and kills him, smashing his head in with a boulder.

> This storyline is Psylocke's last UK appearance -- she then showed up in Uncanny X-Men Annual #10, getting captured by Mojo and having bionic eyes implanted...

> Hope that helped.  And thanks for the unwitting kick in the pants -- I'll try to get back to writing up these UK books.  Grr.

Cheers Jeph, that's helped clear some things up. Sorry if this just highlighted more work for you, and thanks for this indispensable guide.

			*	*	*

Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 07, 2003 at 21:39:44:

Never one to overlook any evidence of Franklin Richards' real age (NOT seven, as he's supposed to be now)...

I was perusing today's issue of Alias and noted that it's mostly a flashback, with the first part occurring "fifteen years ago" and the second part "six months" after that.  During that second part, we see the Surfer battling Galactus from FF 50  (the July following Peter Parker's senior year of high school).  (Incidentally meaning that it's been more than 16 years since Spidey debuted.)

According to Olshevsky's calendar, Franklin Richards was born in August of the year after FF 50.  This would make Franklin 13 1/2 years old or so now, according to the current issue of Alias.

The last clue I noticed about the length of Marvel time was in X 134, in which it was noted that Quentin Quire was born at the time of X 14 (according to Olshevsky, the same month as the Galactus battle above).  That would make Quentin a year older than Franklin, and about 14 1/2 or so at the time of his death.

Just a curious observation.  I'm still convinced that a bit more time has passed, but it's clear from these clues that Marvel has abandoned it's eternal 10-year (since FF 1) rule.

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by Kevin  on May 10, 2003 at 13:47:45:
In Reply to: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 07, 2003 at 21:39:44:

> Just a curious observation.  I'm still convinced that a bit more time has passed, but it's clear from these clues that Marvel has abandoned it's eternal 10-year (since FF 1) rule.

Yes, I would tend to agree with you, but this still doesn't explain how Franklin can still appear to be only 8 years old at the most, (in appearance).

The only thing I can think of is: wasn't there a period a few years back, in the mid 90's, where young Franklin disappeared, and was replaced by a teenage Franklin?  And then young Franklin came back?  That's a period of time where Young Franklin wouldn't age...

			*	*	*

Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 10, 2003 at 21:36:05:
In Reply to: Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
posted by Kevin  on May 10, 2003 at 13:47:45:

Yes, but Franklin wasn't a teenager for a very long period of time.  One could argue that when Franklin "came back" after being Psi-Lord, he returned as a lad much younger than he would have been.  However, I don't think Franklin was his "proper" age even before the Psi-Lord period.

Sean may have a point or two to make on this thread, including the advice not to look at the absolute passage of Marvel Time too closely  ;)

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by SKleefeld on May 11, 2003 at 09:46:21:
In Reply to: Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 10, 2003 at 21:36:05:

> Sean may have a point or two to make on this thread, including the advice not to look at the absolute passage of Marvel Time too closely  ;)

Since I'm never one to pass up an offer like this...  :)

First, the 15-year-since-Spider-Man's-origin thing isn't too far off the mark. Peter still had a couple of years of high school left when he got bitten, and since he's written as someone in their mid- to late 20s, that fits. (Johnny Storm works much the same way.)

But, yeah, it kind of screws the 10 year rule.

As for Franklin's age, we've got several "outs"...

There was a Byrne issue where Franklin physically aged himself to about 30, only to de-age himself at the end of the issue. It doesn't actually say that he de-aged himself back to whatever age he was originally, so he may have turned the clock back a bit too far.

Then, we've got the appearance of Psi-Lord, noted earlier, which shaves off a little time.

Then, there was another instance where Reed literally turned the kid off for a little while. (Somewhere around FF #140 I think.) The comic IIRC speaks more to turning off his brain, but he may have stopped aging during that period as well.

Then, we've got the Days of Future Present storyline where an adult Franklin from the future came to the present. He could well have de-aged his younger self there, so as to postpone dealing with everything he was forced to deal with.

Not to mention we're talking about the single, most powerful mutant. Period. For all we know, he's subconsciously retarding his own aging process and forcing everyone not to notice.

Regardless of whether Marvel's using a 7, 10, or 15 year rule, there is almost no way we legitimately determine Franklin's chronological age because of all the events noted above. The best we can do is simply take the last in-story reference to a specific age as the gospel-of-the-moment. I think the last mention put Franklin at 7 1/2.

But we probably shouldn't be using a calendar system for this anyway.  ;) 

-- Sean

			*	*	*

Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 11, 2003 at 22:00:14:
In Reply to: Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
posted by SKleefeld on May 11, 2003 at 09:46:21:

Sean, I knew I could count on you to offer other plot threads that might account for Franklin's eternal youth.  Given all that you mention, and the fact that we have documentation of other MU characters aging at what must be a more rapid pace than Franklin, we can hypothesize that Franklin's current age of 7 is his current biological age, although it's been more than 7 years since his birth.  Yet, no one in the MU has ever addressed this Franklin paradox.  So either it's been done off-panel (and you'd think this would be important enough to chronicle -- maybe fodder for a continuity implant yet to be published) OR no one realizes the paradox exists because Franklin is warping everyone's perception (more fodder for a story sometime).

I think the upshot of all this is this: don't use Franklin's biological age as a marker for the passage of Marvel Time, if you dare do so at all. ;)

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by Kevin  on May 12, 2003 at 14:06:55:
In Reply to: Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 11, 2003 at 22:00:14:

The real catch will be this:  Now that Franklin has a younger sister, if she continues to age and he doesn't, then that truly poses a problem.  I don't think Marvel would go that far though...surely they'd realize by this point in time that it's time to start letting Franklin grow older...

			*	*	*

Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 12, 2003 at 21:28:23:
In Reply to: Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
posted by Kevin  on May 12, 2003 at 14:06:55:

Good point.  Valeria is obviously no longer a newborn, but rather is probably more than six months old, given that she can sit up on her own.  She's said her first word (albeit way ahead of schedule) and before you know it, she'll be walking and celebrating her first birthday.  Will Franklin still be 7 when that happens?

Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by SKleefeld on May 14, 2003 at 10:54:40:
In Reply to: Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 12, 2003 at 21:28:23:

I think Valeria's age shouldn't be considered either, actually.

Recall, first that when Sue first appeared pregnant with Valeria, she was nearly full-term almost immediately. Second, this girl grows up to be the Valeria we saw in the Claremont issues -- who was able to subconsciously "time dance" her way into a past before she was born. PLUS, she's linked to Dr. Doom via magik, and we know that can be used to extend people's lives (a la the Anicent One and Dr. Strange).

And you're going to tell me that we can use this indiviudal to guage time in the whole continuum??? I think we've got even less justification here than we do with Franklin!

-- Sean

			*	*	*

Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 14, 2003 at 20:00:15:
In Reply to: Re: Latest Alias and Franklin's age
posted by SKleefeld on May 14, 2003 at 10:54:40:

Well, we can use her age as long as it works... ;)

			*	*	*

'Nam as Canon; Ice Phillips has appeared in a mainstream title
Posted by John McDonagh on May 08, 2003 at 17:23:40:

      The issue of the 'Nam as canon came up a while ago. Somebody said we would not have to track anybody other than Frank Castle (the Punisher). Well....not totally true. Ice Phillips was one 'Nam introduced character who appeared in a more mainstream book. He appeared in Punisher War Journal#52-53 and Punisher War Zone#26-30. 

His 'Nam appearances included most of issues#17-41 and #62-66. I have not gotten all of these yet, but if and when I do, I will prepare a chronology for the site.  

As for the sliding timescale problem the 'Nam presents.....well, we'll have to consider these references as topical.

			*	*	*

Recent X-chronology -- Draft
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 08, 2003 at 21:37:54:

As promised, I'm tossing out a revised calendar for recent X-titles (not encyclopedic).  This is just a draft, meant as a starting point for hashing out chronologies, so have at it.

Bear in mind that at this point we're interested in sequential placement and relative timing.  The calendar placement is really tentative at this point, although a lot hinges on the timing of the birth of the Hudsons' baby.

I know Jeph has been working on this too, so I'll be interested to know how our notes compare.

Looking for comments, good and not-so-good, suggestions for re-sequencing, added information, and added titles/issues, etc.

Friday, September 13

NEW X-MEN #128
One night, most likely after XX 19.  Paris is rebuilt, placing this story sometime after UX 408.  Xavier and Jean are in Paris, visiting X-Corp.
			
NEW X-MEN #129
The same night as X 128.

NEW X-MEN #130
The same night as X 129.  Darkstar dies.  This issue is referred to as having occurred yesterday in XX 24 (1-14).

Saturday, September 14

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #1 (14-23)
One day, perhaps a few weeks after XXX 1 (8-13), during which time reporters have been gathering intel on the X-Men.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (1-14)
The day after X 130.  Cannonball assists with rescue and salvage efforts in the Chunnel and stays after the X-Men leave.

Sunday, September 15

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (15-16)
The day after XX 24 (1-14).  Cannonball finishes his work at the Chunnel and leaves the scene.

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #2 (1-18)
Probably the day after XXX 1 (14-23).  This segment occurs before XX 20, but it must be much more than about a week before XXX 2 (19-22).  Conan and Wetherell visit Gambit and Rogue outside Los Angeles.  Gambit and Rogue have been on the road for weeks following XX 19.

Monday, September 16

NEW X-MEN #131 (1)
One morning, probably a few days after X2 130.  Scott and Emma are flying in an X-jet.

NEW X-MEN #131 (2/3) ~ X-TREME X-MEN #24 (17p1-17p3)
The same morning as X 131 (1) and the morning after XX 24 (15-16), so it is three days after X 130.  The X-Men attend Darkstars funeral in a rainy Paris.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (17p4-18p2)
The same morning as XX 24 (17p1-17p3).  After the funeral, Cannonball quits X-Corp and Xavier gives him a playbill for a gig by Lila Cheney in Paris that night.

NEW X-MEN #131 (4-21)
The same day as X 131 (2/3).  Logan is picked up from Madripoor, where I theorize he was called to go from New Orleans.  Since Archangel (who is back at Xaviers now) is still blue here, this issue must occur before UX 410.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (18p3-19)
The same night as XX 24 (17-18).  Cannonball reconnects with Lila Cheney and they teleport off Earth for some R&R.  It is months before XX 24 (20-21).

Tuesday, September 17

NEW X-MEN #132
Probably the day after X 131.  A group of X-Men are on their way from the Paris funeral of Darkstar to India when the stop in Genosha, where Storm has been for three days (thus missing the funeral), so it is more than three days since XX 1 (8-13).  Storm appears to have recovered, or so she may deceive herself into believing  and with Logan having left her for an important reason (Vatican or Madripoor), she has decided to go off to Genosha,  A comment by Sabra about this being the worst weekend of her life suggests that X 131 occurs on Saturday and this issue on a Sunday.  Polaris returns.  According to the introductory notes in X 133, it is one year after the destruction of Genosha in X 115, but that length of time may be too long  six months may be more appropriate.

Wednesday, September 18

NEW X-MEN #133
Probably the day after X 132, as the X-Men arrive in India, with Wolverine making a stop in Afghanistan along the way.  Both Logan and Sunfire appear here, and it is more likely this is before their encounter in XU 39/2.  Behind the scenes, Logan may be told by his teammates about Storms seeming good health in X 132, alleviating some anxiety he may feel about being away from her. The full moon here doesnt mesh with the one in UX 415.

Thursday, September 19

UNCANNY X-MEN #410
UNCANNY X-MEN #411
UNCANNY X-MEN #412
UNCANNY X-MEN #413
UX 410-413 occur during the course of a day, a year after XF 149 and a few weeks before UX 417.  Since this story ends with Archangel losing his blue skin color, it must occur after X 131, and the reference to calling Lorna would place it after X 132.  Warren also breaks his arm and leg in this story.  Xaviers, Jeans, and Logans presence in the USA places the story after X 133 and Jeans absence in X 134.  Chamber has gone off to college, so this occurs after Chamber #1, which I have placed in late August.  Green grass and trees in Vancouver and upstate New York.  Jackets in Vancouver and warm weather at Xaviers.

Monday, September 23

UNCANNY X-MEN #414
One day, months after X 113.  UX 412 is referred to as having occurred the other day. Archangel is still in a cast.  Northstar accepts a teaching position at Xaviers, but is injured in an explosion that puts him in the infirmary.  Green grass and trees in Ontario.

Thursday, September 26

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #1 (14-23)
One day, perhaps a few weeks after XXX 1 (8-13), during which time reporters have been gathering intel on the X-Men.

Friday, September 27

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #2 (1-18)
Probably the day after XXX 1 (14-23).  This segment occurs before XX 20, but it must be much more than about a week before XXX 2 (19-22).  Conan and Wetherell visit Gambit and Rogue outside Los Angeles.  Gambit and Rogue have been on the road for weeks following XX 19.

Sunday, September 29

X-MEN UNLIMITED #42/1
One night with a full moon.  Krystal Van Heiden has captured Emma Frost to use her mutated DNA to create a diamond-like environment at her Crystal Palace in Antarctica.  Emma defeats her.

Friday, October 4

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #2 (19-22)
One evening, supposedly about a week after XXX 2 (1-18), but given Storms and Archangels chronologies, it may be about a month after; this time frame is still believable for the storyline, but shouldnt be much longer than this.  Warren has white skin and no casts, so this segment must occur after UX 414.  It may occur shortly before Iceman discovers that Warren is out of his casts in UX 415.  Warren also sports cropped hair and a goatee.  The snow falling in Manhattan starts when Ororo confronts Warren, so it may be a subconscious manifestation of her mood.  Warren gives her a speech about the X-Men needing to portray a united front, with which Ororo disagrees.  Storm appears recovered here, but I theorize that she collapses right after this scene, and Logan realizes that they were kidding themselves into believing she was okay; he returns her to New Orleans for more rehabilitation.  The newspaper reads Friday, October something.

Saturday, October 5

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (20-21p2)
One day, months after XX 24 (18-19).  Cannonball and Lila return from their time off-planet to Paris, where it is spring and we see green grass and trees.

Sunday, October 6

UNCANNY X-MEN #415
One day, weeks after UX 413, although this reference is inconsistent with the one in UX 414 that UX 412 was the other day, given that UX 414 is referred to here as having occurred the other day.  It is a few days before UX 416.  Archangel is out of his casts, which surprises Iceman as its too soon for Warren to be healed.  Warrens goatee does not appear here; he may have shaved it since XXX 2 (19-22).  Northstar is in the infirmary.  Wolverine is not here, perhaps because hes tending to Storm in New Orleans. Green grass and trees at Westchester.  Full moon.

Monday, October 7

X-TREME X-MEN #20 (1-15)
One day.  Bishop and Sage have returned from California to rejoin Storm and Logan in New Orleans, where Logan oversees her (resumed) rehabilitation.  Logan tells Storm that nature has its own pace (a lesson theyve both learned now) and remarks that shes doing better than expected, nowhere as good as she wants.  Storm also bemoans the fact that her rehab is taking so long; indeed, I have her injury in XX 18 as having occurred months earlier, in July.  Sage refers to the events of X 115 as having occurred recently.  She also references the mutants they met in XXX 1 (8-13), which may not have been very recent, given her comment, Remember California?  Bishop talks of rejoining Xaviers band of X-Men, and Ororo may not have shared with him her encounter with Archangel in XXX 2 (19-22).  Bishop and Sage then investigate some murders on a night with a full moon.

Tuesday, October 8

X-TREME X-MEN #20 (16-22)
The day after XX 20 (1-15).  Bishop and Sage go to Xaviers, where they encounter Emma Frost and the mutant responsible for the murders.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

X-TREME X-MEN #21
The same day as XX 20 (16-22).  Bishop and Sage are teleported away from Xaviers while Emma Frost tries to deal with Garrett, who shes harboring while Professor X is away from the mansion.  Storm tries to reason with Emma from New Orleans, where we see Logan starting to grow the goatee we see fully sprouted in X 135-138.  The weather at Xaviers is so cold that a lake on the grounds is iced over; this is inconsistent with the green grass and trees seen in XX 20 (16-22).

X-TREME X-MEN #22
The same night as XX 21.  Although a student at Xaviers refers to the events of XX 20 (16-22) as the other day, it must have actually been earlier this day.  Bishop and Sage storm the Xavier Institute, forcing Storm, despite her less-than-full recovery, to fly from New Orleans to New York, where she fights Emma.  We see snow on the ground at Xaviers, even before Storms arrival, and this is inconsistent with the green grass and trees seen not only in XX 20 but in this very issue.

X-TREME X-MEN #23 (1-16)
The same night as XX 22.  The X-Men battle Elias Bogan in the Danger Room.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (21p3-21p4)
The same night as XX 23 (1-16).  In Paris, Cannonball and Lila have dinner and read an on-line news item about the events of XX 20.

Wednesday, October 9

X-TREME X-MEN #23 (17-22)
The morning after XX 23 (1-16).  The X-Treme team disagree with Xaviers philosophy and leave Professor X, White Queen, and Jean Grey at the Institute, where we see snow.

X-MEN UNLIMITED #45 (1-24p2)
One day.  A jealous co-worker nearly slays Guardian, and during the ensuing battle, Heather Hudson gives birth to a girl.  It is days before XU 45 (24).  Earthmover wants to go to a Canadiens game, so it must be after the pre-season begins in late September.  Green grass and trees in Canada.

Thursday, October 10

UNCANNY X-MEN #416
One day, a few days after UX 415.  Sammy hasnt been assigned a room at Xaviers yet, presumably because everyones so busy, even though its been weeks since he came on board in UX 410.  Given his awe of X-Men, Glob Hermans appearance here probably predates his joining the Omega Gang in X 135.  Stacy X is released from the infirmary while Northstar is still recuperating.  Lorna has been called about Alex and is expected to arrive at Xaviers in the morning (it is not known where she has been since hooking back up with the X-Men in X 132).  We see green grass and trees at Westchester.  It is cool enough for jackets and trench coats.

UNCANNY X-MEN #417 (1-7)
It must be the same night as UX 416.  As Warren sleeps, dreaming of Psylocke, Paige makes a discovery on the internet about one of Warrens businesses.

Friday, October 11

UNCANNY X-MEN #417 (8-22)
The day after UX 417 (1-7).  It is a few weeks after UX 410-413.  The weather is nice enough for a game of catch.  Husk is dwelling on her past relationship with Chamber; this suggests that this issue must occur before Jonathons return to Xaviers at the end of Chamber #4.  Wolverine is with the group in New York (suggesting that he and Ororo have separated, at least temporarily ) and gets slashed up by Maximus Lobo.

UNCANNY X-MEN #418
The same day as the UX 417 (8-22).  Lorna arrives at Xaviers, so it must be the day after UX 416.  Archangel and Husk try to take on Maximus Lobo.  Green trees in Westchester County.

UNCANNY X-MEN #419
The same day as UX 418.  Archangel and Husk have a respite from Maximus Lobos attack while Havok awakens at Xaviers and Nightcrawler questions God.  Green grass and trees in New York.

UNCANNY X-MEN #420
The same day as UX 419.  Warren discovers that his blood has healing powers as the X-Men defeat Maximus Lobo and his werewolves.  Given Warrens discovery, this story must occur before XU 45 (24).  Green grass and trees in New York.

Saturday, October 12

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 (1-21p1)
Probably the day after UX 420.  Scott and Jean seem to be on friendly terms, so this segment should occur prior to Jeans trip to Hong Kong, first referenced in X 134 (3-22).  Juggernaut asks to stay with the X-Men.  Professor X fills Havok in on what he missed during his coma, then Polaris proposes to Havok and they plan to leave on an archaeological dig.  Nightcrawler decides to join them.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

Sunday, October 13

X-MEN UNLIMITED #44
One hot day, with green grass and trees in Westchester.  Given the relationship that has grown between Sammy and Juggernaut, this story likely occurs after UX 421 (1-21) and before Sammys departure in UX 422.  Jean is at Xaviers in this story, and she meets Sammy for the first time, so it cant be very long after UX 410.  Juggernaut learns a lesson as the X-Men deal with some local boys who torture animals.  There appears to be no school today, so it is likely a weekend day if this occurs during the school season (although there are apparently Sunday classes, as in X 135).

Monday, October 14

X-MEN UNLIMITED #45 (24p3-24p7)
One day, days after XU 45 (1-24).  Archangel uses his new healing power to save Guardian, so this segment must occur between UX 420 and UX 421 (23-24).  Jean and Logan are here too.

Tuesday, October 15

MYSTIQUE #1 (1-8)
One night.  It must be a weeknight, as Charles Xavier appears on Nightline.  Jean is at Xaviers, so this story probably occurs before her departure for Hong Kong prior to X 134 (3-22).  We learn that Xavier has covert operatives in the world and that one has been killed on a mission.

Wednesday, October 16

MYSTIQUE #1 (9-23)
The early morning after MYS 1 (1-8).  At 2:54 AM, Xavier arrives at Forges apartment in Baltimore to ask him to find Mystique.  At 3:12 AM, Mystique is on a mission in Washington DC.

NEW X-MEN #134 (1-2)
One rainy night.  Mutant designer Jumbo Carnation dies.  This event is noted as having occurred the other night in X 135 (1-14).

Thursday, October 17

NEW X-MEN #134 (3-22)
The day after X 134 (1-2).  Logan is not at Xaviers.  Reference is made to Jean being in Hong Kong and expected home soon after being away for a while; however, it seems Jean may run into unexpected delays, as she doesnt make it back home until X 138 (16-23).  We see green grass and autumn leaves in Westchester and there is a reference that is made to it being late summer.

Sunday, October 20

NEW X-MEN #135 (1-14)
A school day at Xaviers.  Xavier notes that he is opening the doors to the Institute to non-mutants in three days time.  Since X 138 labels Open Day a Wednesday, this then must be a Sunday; X 121 establishes that Xavier's doesnt hold to traditional human school practices, so there may very well be Sunday classes.  Quentin Quire has changed considerably in recent weeks.  Quire refers to the murder of Jumbo Carnation in X 134 (1-2) as having occurred the other night.  Glob Herman probably appears here after UX 416. We see green grass and trees in Westchester and its seasonable enough for Xorns Special Class (which is convening for the first time) to go camping.  Because of its special nature, Xorns class may not follow the traditional semester.  High on kick, Quentin Quire and his Omega Gang assault a group of mutant-hating youths.

Monday, October 21

NEW X-MEN #135 (15-22)
The day after X 135 (1-14).  Xavier discusses the Quire situation telepathically with his X-Men, including Jean, who is still in Hong Kong, and Logan, who isnt necessarily at Xaviers.  Xorn continues the camping trip with the Special Class.  Green grass and trees.

Tuesday, October 22

NEW X-MEN #136 (1-21)
The night of the day after X 135 (15-22).  The Omega Gang attacks a group of U-Men, and a squad of U-Men attacks the Special Class, who are still on the camping trip.  Beak and Angel have sex, apparently for the first time, given the dialog.  Xorn defeats the U-Men and the class is taken back to Xaviers school, where the Omega Gang capture Xavier.  It is before a Friday.  Green grass and trees.

Wednesday, October 23

NEW X-MEN #136 (22)
The morning after X 136 (1-21).  It is Open Day at Xaviers, the day that Xavier has invited non-mutants to tour the school for possible enrollment, perhaps for the semester following this.  The Omega Gang begin their attack on the school.  According to XX 24, this issue occurs after XX 23.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

NEW X-MEN #137
The same day as X 136 (22).  Wolverine is back at Xaviers, sporting a goatee.  The X-Men battle the Omega Gang.  In the end, Quentin Quire is defeated and Sophie of the Stepford Cuckoos is killed.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

NEW X-MEN #138 (1-6)
The same day as X 137.  The X-Men deal with the aftermath of the Omega Gangs riot on a Wednesday.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

Thursday, October 24

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (21p5-22p1)
Probably the day after X 138 (1-6).  Still in Paris, Cannonball and Lila learn of the riot at Xaviers via the internet.

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 (21p2-23p6)
One day.  Havok and Polaris leave with Nightcrawler for Bermuda.  Cyclops is among those who see them off, but Jean is not.  It is two days before UX 421 (23-24).  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

Saturday, October 26

UNCANNY X-MEN #422  FB
One day.  Stacy X makes a risque video for Warren before leaving Xaviers.

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 (23p7-24)
Probably the same night as UX 422-FB.  2 nights after UX 421 (21-23), Alpha Flight barges into Xaviers school to take the children.  Heather Hudson is no longer pregnant and James Hudson is healed, so this segment must occur after XU 45 (24)  and apparently the Hudsons gratefulness for Warren saving James has waned.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

UNCANNY X-MEN #422
The same night as UX 421 (23-24).  Nightcrawler, Havok, and Polaris discover an ancient mutant city on an archaeological dig and encounter the Church of Humanity.  Warren watches Stacys video.  Chamber appears back at Xaviers after Chamber #4.  Alpha Flight have come to retrieve the children at Xaviers school in the wake of the recent riot of X 135-137.  The X-Men battle Alpha Flight and only Squidboy ends up leaving Xaviers in the end.  A conversation between Juggernaut and Squidboy leads one to assume that Emma is alive, so this issue must occur before X 139 (21-22).  It is a few weeks before UX 423.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.  Full moon.

Tuesday, October 29

NEW X-MEN #138 (7-9)
It is a Tuesday, so it is likely six days after X 138 (1-6).  The remaining Stepford Cuckoos announce that they will depart Xaviers after the upcoming prize-giving ceremony and walk out on Emma Frost, who notes that she is twenty-seven.  This would make her a teenager at the time of her debut in UX 129.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

Thursday, October 31

NEW X-MEN #138 (10-14)
A Thursday.  Xorn helps Quentin Quire cast off his physical body and achieve another plane of existence.  Xavier notes that the school will be closing for the summer in exactly six days.  The break may be a week-long autumn break.  He also notes that after the break, he will step down as headmaster.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

Friday, November 1

NEW X-MEN #138 (15)
The day after X 138 (10-14), a Friday.  Emma Frost goes clothes shopping with Angel.  According to X 140, this segment occurs a few days before X 139 (21-22).

Saturday, November 2

NEW X-MEN #138 (16-23)
The day after X 138 (15), a Saturday.  We see a prize-giving ceremony at Xaviers, where there are green grass and trees.  Angel informs Beak that shes pregnant with his child; this revelation so soon after their apparent first sexual encounter in X 136 (1-21) is an indication that Angels physiology is radically different from a normal humans.  That night, Jean Grey returns to Xaviers with Sooraya and finds Scott and Emma in a compromising situation.

NEW X-MEN #139 (1-20)
The same day as X 138 (16-23).  An angry Jean mucks around with Emmas mind and the X-Men grow concerned about Jeans Phoenix power.  Cyclops takes off.  The Stepford Cuckoos state that school is over for the summer, implying that, while the school itself is to close on the upcoming Wednesday, classes are already over.  We see green grass and trees at Xaviers.

Tuesday, November 5

NEW X-MEN #139 (21-22)
One night.  According to X 140, this segment occurs a few days after X 138 (15).  Beast finds Emmas diamond body smashed to pieces.  Given Emmas seeming death here, this segment must occur after UX 422.

Wednesday, November 6

NEW X-MEN #140 (1-14)
The day after X 139 (21-22).  It is sometime after XX 23 (17-22).  Summer vacation is cancelled until further notice, while Bishop and Sage are called in to investigate Emma Frosts murder.  Late this day, the Stepford Cuckoos note that school ought to have closed for summer by now, so it is likely that this is the day the school was scheduled to close, six days after X 138 (10-14).  Scott is still absent. Nightcrawler is back from the archaeological expedition.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

Thursday, November 7

NEW X-MEN #140 (15-22)
The day after X 140 (1-14).  Bishop and Sage continue their investigation, and Angels brood of larvae are discovered.

NEW X-MEN #141
The same day as X 140 (15-22).

Friday, November 8

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (22p2)
One day.  Cannonball learns that things with the X-Treme team are serious, though Im not sure what the exact reference is.

Monday, November 11

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (22p3-23)
One day.  Cannonball calls Storm to Paris, where we see green trees.  He accepts her offer to join her.  Since Sam was only keeping track of the X-Men via the web until this point, it is likely that he joins his former New Mutants teammates in XU 43/1 (5-15) after this.

Saturday, November 16

UNCANNY X-MEN #423
One day, a few weeks after UX 422.  Nightcrawler, Havok, and Polaris are all at Xaviers.  Scott has returned to Xaviers and things between him and Jean appear to be icy, so this segment must occur after X 141.  Logans goatee is gone.  The Church of Humanity leaves a calling card in front of Xaviers  a bunch of crucified mutants, including Jubilee, Magma, and Skin.  Archangels healing powers save the former two, but Angelo dies.  Xorn and Xavier cannot be reached; has Xavier left the school as he intended to do?  After Cyclops chews out Kurt for not briefing the team about the Church, they discover that someones been messing with Kurt through his presumed life as a priest.  That night, they find some unholy lab beneath St. Michaels Church.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

UNCANNY X-MEN #424
The same night as UX 423.  

Tuesday, November 26

X-TREME X-MEN #25
One day.  It is probably a weekday during the college year.  In freeing Stryker from incarceration, Deathstrike makes it appear that Stryker was killed in an airplane explosion by the X-Men.  We see snow in the Rockies and green trees in Kentucky, where Cannonball has invited Storm, Bishop, Sage, and Wolverine (sans goatee), perhaps for Thanksgiving(?)  The X-Men investigate the site of the plane crash.  Kitty sees her school psychologist, and that night, she is abducted from the Belles of Hell by Deathstrike and Stryker.

NOTE: UX 43/1 would happen sometime after this, as the New Mutants reunite in that story, leading into the new New Mutants title; this implies that Cannonball is no longer with the X-Treme team.

Of course some of the above will morph as new issues (and new clues) are published.

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Recent X-chronology -- Draft
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 09, 2003 at 12:26:15:
In Reply to: Recent X-chronology -- Draft
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 08, 2003 at 21:37:54:

You've got X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #1 (14-23) and X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #2 (1-18) listed twice.  Once on 9/14-15 and then again on 9/26-27.

			*	*	*

A few comments
Posted by Jeph! on May 09, 2003 at 16:23:19:
In Reply to: Recent X-chronology -- Draft
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 08, 2003 at 21:37:54:

Paul, I'm printing out this draft of yours and bringing it to work with me -- hopefully I can comment more intelligently on it tonight or tomorrow.  However, a few quick notes:

1)  XU #43/1 DOESN'T lead to the reunion "New Mutants" series -- in fact, the cast is decidedly different.  The upcoming NM2 series is forbidden from using Cannonball BECAUSE he's a member of XX -- so the assumption that he leaves XX to appear in XU #43/1 is faulty.

I place this story before X #128, mainly because Bobby KNOWS where Sam is and is able to call him in this story -- so Sam must have a stable base of operations, and between X #128 and XX #25, he doesn't.

2) More time passes in XX #24 that you have listed.  You place Sam's time volunteering with the rescue team at two days, but clues indicate it's longer than that.  On page 4, which is the day after X #128-130, Sam finds a survivor.  Page 7 states that "no survivors have been discovered for over 24 hours", indicating that p.7 occurs the following day -- two days after X #130.  Pp.7-14 seem to occur the same day, and the "much, MUCH later" narration on p.15 seems to indicate a third day has passed.

Darkstar's funeral, "the next morning" on p.17, then, must be FOUR days after X #130 -- and that distinction will be important in a minute.

X #132 is labelled as the same "weekend" as Darkstar's funeral -- so X #131 and XX #24 pp.17-19 must occur on a Saturday, and X #132 on a Sunday (you note the "weekend" reference, but have them listed as Monday and Tuesday).  X #132, then, is five days after X #130.

Storm, appearing in X #132, says she's been in Genosha for three days -- meaning that she left New Orleans two days after X #130.

Now, XXX #1 p.6 references "the incident in the Channel Tunnel", placing it after X #130.  Neal and Manoli then travel to New Orleans (pp.7-14, in what COULD be the same day) and interview Storm.  Because she is BARELY able to walk in this scene, we must place it BEFORE X #132, where she is able to walk relatively easily.

Soooo, by process of elimination, the only day that XXX #1 pp.6-13 could occur is the only free day Storm has before leaving for Genosha -- one day after X #130 and four days before X #132.  And THAT'S why divining that extra day from XX #24 is important.

This also gives Wolverine three days to get from New Orleans to Madripoor, where he travels to France from in X #131.

My calendar, in progress, for that time period:

----
----

date unknown

* X-MEN UNLIMITED #43 (first story)
Sunspot knew where to call Cannonball to find him, so this story must occur before the Channel Tunnel incident that caused Sam to quit X-Corp and leave Earth with Lila Cheney for "months" (see XX #24).

----
Monday

* X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #1 pp.5
Reporters visit X-Corp in Paris, trying to speak to Prof. X or Archangel, both of whom are implied to be in Paris at that time.  Probably shortly before X #128-130, as THESE reporters make no mention of the Chunnel incident, and the lobby (attacked by troops in X #129) is spotless.  Also, by X #131, five days from now, Archangel is back at the school.

----
Tuesday

NEW X-MEN #128-130
One day, mostly at night.  Jean and Prof. X have begun their FIRST worldwide trip on X-Corp's behalf, beginning in Paris.  Weapon XII crashes a train in the Channel Tunnel, and Darkstar is killed.

----
Wednesday

* X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp. 1-6
Cannonball helps the rescue workers at the Channel Tunnel crash site, the day after the accident (and probably same day as XXX #1 pp.5-7).

* X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #1 pp.6-13
Likely the day after XXX #1 pp.5.  The reporters are now in New Orleans, speaking to Storm and Wolverine.  Storm manages to stand, but cannot yet fly.  It's unknown if she can walk.  It seems as if Logan has been there for her the whole time since XX #19.  However, Logan is next seen in X #131, returning "from Madripoor"  so he needs a bit of time to get from New Orleans to Madripoor (plus, y'know, a reason might be good).

----
Thursday

* X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp. 7-14
Cannonball is STILL volunteering.  News reports say that no survivors have been found for over 24 hours, and a survivor was found on p.4  so this is likely the day after pp.1-6, TWO days after X #130 (and the same day as XXX #1 pp.8-13).

* WOLVERINE v2 #183 (second story)
Using the passage of time the books give us, Storm leaves for Genosha on this date, three days before X #132.  Therefore, one can assume Logan left for Madripoor on the same date.  It's odd, given that Ororo is portrayed as unwell in XXX #1 pp.8-13 and walking in X #132, but it is consistent with all her other appearances showing her to be healing but impatient, and constantly overexerting herself (walking, trying to fly, etc.).  In any event, I needed a rationale for Logan to travel to the Madripoor area of the world.  Having him hear of the whereabouts of Lady Deathstrike, whom he'd vowed to find and kill for what she did in W2 #173-176, seemed like a good impetus.  He could have then travelled to Madripoor the next day, or later that same day.

----
Friday

* X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp.15-16
"Much, MUCH later", all bodies have been accounted for.  At the very LEAST, it's the day after Sam actually finds more survivors on p.13.  Possibly two days, given the other books.

----
Saturday

NEW X-MEN #131 pp.1-3
Darkstar's funeral.  Going by XX #24, it's been four or five days since X #130.

* X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp.17-18
"The next day" after pp.15-16, Cannonball attends Darkstar's funeral, in a scene ripped from X #131.  Prof. X accepts Sam's resignation from X-Corp.

NEW X-MEN #131 pp.4-21
Archangel is blue here, placing it before UX #410.  Logan has most recently been in Madripoor, according to Cyclops (and he's likely being dropped off in Afghanistan here).  It's the first time Scott and Jean have been together for "weeks" (since X #127).

* X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp.18-19
The night of Darkstar's funeral, Sam leaves Earth with Lila Cheney, and doesn't return for "months".

----
Sunday

NEW X-MEN #132
Someone refers to Darkstar's funeral and this issue as "the worst weekend of their life", implying that this issue is the day after X #131.  Storm has been in Genosha for "three days", meaning she left on the date I've placed W2 #183/2.  We see her walk but not fly.  Prof. X and Jean are "on their way to India".  Since France, Genosha, and India are NOT in a straight line, I have to assume that they're following a planned itinerary of X-Corp locales.

----

Like I said -- hopefully more tonight!

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Re: A few comments
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 09, 2003 at 20:14:10:
In Reply to: A few comments
posted by Jeph! on May 09, 2003 at 16:23:19:

Good work here.  Keep it coming.  I'm updating as we go along, and I'm correcting errors I've noticed myself.  Sometimes things get missed as bits and pieces of issues get moved around on the calendar...

> 1)  XU #43/1 DOESN'T lead to the reunion "New Mutants" series -- in fact, the cast is decidedly different.  The upcoming NM2 series is forbidden from using Cannonball BECAUSE he's a member of XX -- so the assumption that he leaves XX to appear in XU #43/1 is faulty.

> I place this story before X #128, mainly because Bobby KNOWS where Sam is and is able to call him in this story -- so Sam must have a stable base of operations, and between X #128 and XX #25, he doesn't.

Okey doke.  I wasn't privvy to the details of the New Mutants title.

> X #132 is labelled as the same "weekend" as Darkstar's funeral -- so X #131 and XX #24 pp.17-19 must occur on a Saturday, and X #132 on a Sunday (you note the "weekend" reference, but have them listed as Monday and Tuesday).

One of those boo-boos in moving things around, I'm afraid.

> Now, XXX #1 p.6 references "the incident in the Channel Tunnel", placing it after X #130.  

Good call.

> * X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #1 pp.6-13
> Likely the day after XXX #1 pp.5.  

I assume you mean two days after.

> * WOLVERINE v2 #183 (second story)

The addition of Wolverine stories (regular series and various mini-series) would indeed help.

That "months"-long interim in XX 24 may not work given other chronologies, but I'll wait to see what you have to say on that matter.  I give the interim two weeks, at least for now.

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: A few comments
Posted by Paul O'Brien on May 10, 2003 at 07:54:31:
In Reply to: A few comments
posted by Jeph! on May 09, 2003 at 16:23:19:

> I place this story before X #128, mainly because Bobby KNOWS where Sam is and is able to call him in this story -- so Sam must have a stable base of operations, and between X #128 and XX #25, he doesn't.

He also has a stable base of operations during XX24, when he's living in Paris with Lila after they return from space with Lila.  Given the news stories he's seen keeping track of, that spans a fair period of time.  Since Xavier evidently knew Lila was in town, and Sam didn't part with the X-Men on bad terms, there's no reason to think that his address in Paris is a secret.

			*	*	*

NEMESIS...NIGHT...NIGHT RIDER (I, II and III)
Posted by Arthur Stein on May 09, 2003 at 14:44:25:

new entries marked **

NEMESIS
**AF 76
**AF 79
**AF 80
AF 84

NIGHT
ST2 18
** C&D3 1
** C&D3 2
C&D3 12

To be honest, the western genre is not my forte by any means. I thought of skipping the Night Rider entries to avoid making a fool of myself but then decided to risk it anyway. 

NIGHT RIDER
  --real name Carter Slade as revealed in GR2 50 (and probably several Western mags as well)
GR 3
GR2 50
GR2 51/2-FB
GR 4
G-S KID COLT 3
A 141-BTS
** I think the A 141 appearance is more than a just a BTS entry. Night Riders voice is heard on the last page It is, rather, 1873, Demons --- the last year you shall ever know.  It is distinguishable from the other unseen members of the group because 1) the style of speech balloon (wavy edges) is the style used for Night Rider in A 142 and elsewhere, and 2) The voice  refers to them as Demons, which is how Night Rider addresses them on pg 1 of A 142  the others refer to the group with more western terms like owlhoots or rannies.

A 142
A 143
THOR CORPS 3
WESTERN GUNFIGHTERS 6
** WCA2 19-FB  Maybe. I do not have Western Gunfighters 6, so I do not know if the scenes of Carter Slades death in WCA2 19-FB (pg 6/1  6/2) are redundant or new.

**WCA2 41  (Carters spirit)
**M/CP 102/4  Once again, the old merged characters issue. In WCA2 41 pg 27/7, the spirit of Carter Slade merged with Hamilton Slade. Do all further occurrences of Hamilton Slade  (like this one) simultaneously evoke the occurrence of Carter Slade?  
-----------------------------------------------
There are also entries under Phantom Rider and Phantom Rider II. 
The Phantom Rider entry has a referral to Night Rider III  shown as Hamilton Slade. Hamilton Slade is also listed as Phantom Rider II.  I am by no means an expert on the Western genre, but Lincoln Slade was referred to as Phantom Rider in WCA2 20 - 23 and Carter Slades sprit in WCA2 41 Pg 8 refers to himself as the original Phantom Rider from a century past.   Certainly Hamilton Slade was Night Rider in some magazines and Phantom Rider in others. The names appear to be exchangeable. Maybe they should be merged with only a see reference under one or the other)

NOTE: as only the disembodied spirit of Lincoln Slade appears in WCA2 35  Pg 15/3, I have NOT included this reference under Hamilton's NIGHT RIDER III below although it IS listed under his PHANTOM RIDER II.

NIGHT RIDER II/LINCOLN SLADE
Beside any Marvel western appearances
**WCA2 19-FB  (pg 6/1  6/2, as with Carter Slade, these scenes may not have anything not seen before in the Western mags)
**WCA2 18
**WCA2 19
**WCA2 20
**WCA2 21
**WCA2 22
**WCA2 23
**WCA2 29
**WCA2 31
**WCA2 32
**WCA2 34
**WCA2 35 
**WCA2 39
**WCA2 41
**M/CP 102/4  as above: the merged character issue 

NIGHT RIDER III/HAMILTON SLADE
GR2 56
H2 265
WCA2 8
WCA2 9-FB
**WCA2 29 (last panel; Lincoln Slades spirit controls Hamiltons body, as revealed in WCA2 31 14/2. As Night rider in WCA2 29 is shown as standing on solid ground, it seems more likely that it is the possessed physical body than that it is just a disembodied spirit.
WCA2 31
WCA2 32
**WCA2 34 (relocated from Phantom Rider II)
**WCA2 39 (relocated from Phantom Rider II)
WCA2 41
M/CP 102/4 (relocated from Phantom Rider II)

Note to newcomers. Just to explain what my postings areas an avid Marvelist I had my own version of this Marvel Chronology Project (MCP). I am now comparing the two, and for all character entries in the MCP, I am checking if I have any appearances that may have been overlooked. Validating them. Chronologizing them. Posting them (so others have an opportunity to refute or comment). The aim... to help in the completeness of this magnificent piece of information engineering! 

#87

			*	*	*

MC2 Universe Chronology version 1.1
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 09, 2003 at 19:51:59:

Hi, all.

Here's the first version of my MC2 chronology. Keep in mind that I do not have access to issues 2-3 and 10-12 of J2. If anyone has scans to e-mail or wants to mail them to me, please contact me at jimmyflowers1@yahoo.com.

I will be adding the latest issues of Spider-Girl (54-59) once the final part of the current 6-part story is released.

NOTES:
FB = Flashback
TT = Time Travel
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 2 is noncanon.
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 3 is merely a recap.

Issue:
A-Next 10-FB
Spider-Girl 010-TT (Page 9, panel 3 through Page 20)
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)
Spider-Girl 044 (Page 15, panels 3 and 5)
Spider-Girl 048-FB1 (Page 6, panels 2-3)
Spider-Girl 048-FB2 (Page 9)
Spider-Girl 049-FB1 (Page 1, panels 2, 4, and 6)
Spider-Girl 049-FB2 (Page 7, panels 2+)
Spider-Girl 049-FB3 (Page 9, panel 2 thru Page 10, panel 3)
Spider-Girl 048-FB3 (Page 10, panels 5-6)
Spider-Girl 049-FB4 (Page 14, panels 2-4)
Spider-Girl 049-FB5 (Page 16, panel 3 thru Page 19, panel 4)
Spider-Girl 007 (Pages 21-22)
Spider-Girl 032-FB1 (Page 11, panels 2 through 3)
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panel 3)
Spider-Girl 039-FB (Page 15, panel 4)
Spider-Girl 040-FB1 (Pages 13-14)
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)
A-Next 07-FB3 (Pages 18-19)
J2 07-FB1 (Pages 6-8)
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panels 4 thru 5)
J2 01
A-Next 01
J2 02
A-Next 02
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 001
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
J2 03
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 005
J2 04
J2 05
A-Next 05
Spider-Girl 006
Spider-Girl 007
J2 06 Story 1
J2 06 Story 2
J2 06 Story 3
Spider-Girl 008
J2 07 Story 1
J2 07 Story 2
J2 07 Story 3
Spider-Girl 009
J2 08
Spider-Girl 010
Spider-Girl 011
A-Next 06
J2 09 Story 1
J2 09 Story 2
J2 09 Story 3
A-Next 07
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11
The Buzz 1-FB1 (Page 4, panel 3 thru page 9)
Spider-Girl 012
The Buzz 1-FB2 (Page 10)
The Buzz 1
The Buzz 2 (Pages 1-8)
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 1 (Pages 1-25)
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 4 (Pages 47 thru 48)
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 5 (Pages 49-55)
A-Next 12
Fantastic Five 1
Wild Thing 0
Wild Thing 1
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 015
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4
Wild Thing 2 Story 1
Wild Thing 2 Story 2
Wild Thing 3 Story 1
Wild Thing 3 Story 2
Fantastic Five 5
Spider-Girl 016
Wild Thing 4 Story 1
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Spider-Girl 017
Wild Thing 5 Story 1
Wild Thing 5 Story 2
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 019
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
The Buzz 2 (Pages 9+)
Spider-Girl 023
The Buzz 3 (Pages 1-5)
Spider-Girl 024
Spider-Girl One-Half
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 051
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052
Spider-Girl 053

			*	*	*

MC2 Universe Character Chronology version 1.0
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 09, 2003 at 19:55:35:

Hi, all.

Here's the first version of my MC2 chronology. Keep in mind that I do not have access to issues 2-3 and 10-12 of J2. If anyone has scans to e-mail or wants to mail them to me, please contact me at jimmyflowers1@yahoo.com.

I will be adding the latest issues of Spider-Girl (54-59) once the final part of the current 6-part story is released.

NOTES:
FB = Flashback
TT = Time Travel
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 2 is noncanon.
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 3 is merely a recap.

ALLEN, LIZ
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)

AMERICAN DREAM/SHANNON CARTER
Spider-Girl 032-FB1 (Page 11, panels 2 through 3)
A-Next 01
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
A-Next 06
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11
A-Next 12
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032

ANGEL FACE
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050

ANT-MAN 2/SCOTT LANG
A-Next 01
A-Next 02
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 05
A-Next 06
A-Next 07
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 12

APOX, THE OMEGA SKRULL
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047

ARGO THE ALMIGHTY
A-Next 06
A-Next 12

BANNON, BUZZ
The Buzz 1-FB1 (Page 4, panel 3 thru page 9)
The Buzz 1-FB2 (Page 10)
The Buzz 1

BARON ZEMO (ALTERNATE EARTH)
A-Next 11

BIG BRAIN
Spider-Girl 003
A-Next 05
Fantastic Five 1
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 5
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050

BIG JULIE THE GANGSTER GORILLA
Wild Thing 3 Story 2

BIG JULIE THE GANGSTER GORILLA/JULIUS S. BRIDWELL
J2 09 Story 1

BIG MAN/HENRY PYM II
A-Next 12

BINDER
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3

BISSETTE, DOCTOR JENNIFER
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)

BLACK CAT/FELICIA HARDY
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 053

BLACKLIGHT
A-Next 09
A-Next 12

BLANCHET, JAKE
Spider-Girl 006

BLUESTREAK
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
A-Next 06
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11
A-Next 12
Spider-Girl 013
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031

BRADY, MEGYN
Spider-Girl 053

BRANT, BETTY
Spider-Girl 010-TT (Page 9, panel 3 through Page 20)
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)

BREWSTER, COLIN
Wild Thing 1
Wild Thing 2 Story 1
Wild Thing 5 Story 1

BRYCE-JONES, CAMERON
Wild Thing 1
Wild Thing 2 Story 1
Wild Thing 3 Story 1
Wild Thing 5 Story 1

BULLET
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3

BULLSEYE
J2 07 Story 2

CALIBAN
J2 07-FB1 (Pages 6-8)

CANIS
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043

CAPTAIN AMERICA
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

CAPTAIN AMERICA (ALTERNATE EARTH)
A-Next 10-FB

CAPTAIN RUIZ
Spider-Girl 001

CARTER, PEGGY
Spider-Girl 032-FB1 (Page 11, panels 2 through 3)

COAL TIGER/PRINCE T'CHAKA
A-Next 04
A-Next 12

CRAZY EIGHT
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041

CRIMSON CURSE/AERIKA HARKNESS
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
A-Next 06
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

CUSSLER, LISA
Spider-Girl 045

CYCLOPS
J2 07 Story 1

DARKDEVIL/REILLY TYNE
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 012
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 023
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

DEACON
J2 04

DEADEYE
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

DIABLO
Fantastic Five 5

DOC MAGUS
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
J2 04

DOCTOR DOOM (ALTERNATE EARTH)
A-Next 10-FB
A-Next 11

DOCTOR DOOM 3/KRISTOFF VERNARD
A-Next 05
Fantastic Five 5

DOCTOR OCTOPUS
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)

DOCTOR STRANGE
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
Wild Thing 0

DOMINATOR
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4

DONAR/THOR (ALTERNATE EARTH)
A-Next 11

DRAGON KING/CARLTON T. HACKMUTTER
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 025

DRAGONFIST
Spider-Girl 024

DUFFY, DARREL
Spider-Girl 022

DURAN, COURTNEY
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 006
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 010
Spider-Girl 011
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 1 (Pages 1-25)
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 4 (Pages 47 thru 48)
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 015
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 019
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 023
Spider-Girl One-Half
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 053

DURAN, MR.
Spider-Girl 050

DURAN, MRS.
Spider-Girl 050

EAGLE
J2 01
J2 07 Story 1

EARTH SENTRY/JOHN FOSTER
A-Next 02
A-Next 12

EARTHSHAKER
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 021

ELECTRA
Spider-Girl 051

ELEKTRA
J2 05
J2 07 Story 2
Wild Thing 2 Story 1

ENTHRALLA
J2 02
J2 08
Spider-Girl One-Half

FEIN, DR. HOWARD
Spider-Girl 026

FIREBIRD
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)

FIRESTAR
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)

FOSTER, DOCTOR WILLIAM
A-Next 02

FREEBOOTER
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
A-Next 06
A-Next 07
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11
A-Next 12
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 045

FREEFALL
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3

FREEMAN, KENDRA
A-Next 09

FUNNY FACE
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050

GIANT-MAN/HENRY PYM
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)

GILCREST, DR. LENNY
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3

GIRANO, MAYOR
J2 05

GOLD, MONTANA
J2 01
J2 07 Story 3
J2 08
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Wild Thing 5 Story 2

GOLDEN GOBLIN (AKA GREEN GOBLIN 4)/PHIL URICH
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 005
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 012
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 023
Spider-Girl 024
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

GRANT, JAMEESIA
A-Next 09

GREEN GOBLIN 1/NORMAN OSBORN JR.
Spider-Girl 044 (Page 15, panels 3 and 5)
Spider-Girl 048-FB1 (Page 6, panels 2-3)
Spider-Girl 048-FB2 (Page 9)
Spider-Girl 049-FB5 (Page 16, panel 3 thru Page 19, panel 4)

GREEN GOBLIN 6/NORMAN OSBORN III
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 019
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

GRIMM, ALYCE
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Fantastic Five 5

GRIMM, JACOB
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Fantastic Five 5

GROOTE, LEONARD
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 1 (Pages 1-25)

HALLENDALE, MILLER
J2 01
J2 07 Story 3
J2 08
J2 09 Story 1
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Wild Thing 5 Story 2

HALPERN, HOLLY
A-Next 09

HAWKEYE/CLINT BARTON
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)
A-Next 10
A-Next 12

HERCULES
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)
A-Next 06

HICKS, RALPHIE
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 045

HULK
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
J2 03
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
Wild Thing 0

HUMAN TORCH 2/JOHNNY STORM
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)
Spider-Girl 007 (Pages 21-22)
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
A-Next 05
Fantastic Five 1
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4
Fantastic Five 5
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050

HYPERSTORM
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)

IMPACT
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3

INVISIBLE WOMAN/SUE RICHARDS
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Fantastic Five 4

ION MAN
A-Next 07
A-Next 12

IRON CROSS/ANTHONY "TONY" STARK (ALTERNATE EARTH)
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

IRON DESPOT
Wild Thing 5 Story 1

IRON FIST/DANNY RAND
Spider-Girl 024

IRON MAN/ANTHONY "TONY" STARK
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)
A-Next 07-FB3 (Pages 18-19)
A-Next 10
A-Next 12

IRON MAN/TONY STARK
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032

J2/ZANE YAMA-MARKO
J2 06 Story 3
J2 01
A-Next 01
J2 02
A-Next 02
Spider-Girl 000
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
J2 03
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
J2 04
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
J2 06 Story 3
Spider-Girl 008
J2 07 Story 1
J2 07 Story 3
J2 08
A-Next 06
J2 09 Story 1
J2 09 Story 3
A-Next 07
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11
A-Next 12
Spider-Girl 013
Wild Thing 2 Story 2
Wild Thing 3 Story 2
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Wild Thing 5 Story 2
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031

JADE, DR. SONIA
The Buzz 1-FB1 (Page 4, panel 3 thru page 9)
The Buzz 1
The Buzz 2 (Pages 1-8)
The Buzz 2 (Pages 9+)
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)

JAMESON, DR. MARLA
The Buzz 1-FB1 (Page 4, panel 3 thru page 9)
The Buzz 1
The Buzz 2 (Pages 1-8)
The Buzz 3 (Pages 1-5)

JAMESON, J. JONAH
Spider-Girl 010-TT (Page 9, panel 3 through Page 20)
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)
The Buzz 1-FB1 (Page 4, panel 3 thru page 9)
Spider-Girl 012
The Buzz 1
The Buzz 2 (Pages 1-8)
Spider-Girl 015
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 022
The Buzz 2 (Pages 9+)
Spider-Girl 023
The Buzz 3 (Pages 1-5)
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 032

JARVIS (ALTERNATE EARTH), EDWIN
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

JARVIS, EDWIN
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)
A-Next 07-FB3 (Pages 18-19)
A-Next 01
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
J2 08
A-Next 07
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 12

JOLT/HALLIE TAKAHAMA
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panel 3)
A-Next 01
Spider-Girl 000

JUBILEE/JUBILATION LEE
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panel 3)
J2 01
A-Next 01
Spider-Girl 000
A-Next 04
J2 07 Story 1
Wild Thing 3 Story 1

JUGGERNAUT/CAIN MARKO
J2 07-FB1 (Pages 6-8)
Wild Thing 2 Story 2
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Wild Thing 5 Story 2

JUSTICE
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)

KAINE
Spider-Girl 049-FB3 (Page 9, panel 2 thru Page 10, panel 3)
Spider-Girl 048-FB3 (Page 10, panels 5-6)
Spider-Girl 048-FB4 (Page 19, panel 1)
Spider-Girl 049-FB4 (Page 14, panels 2-4)
Spider-Girl 012
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

KILLERWATT
Spider-Girl 009
A-Next 12

KINGPIN
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043

KIRBY, DAVIDA
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 006
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 010
Spider-Girl 011
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 1 (Pages 1-25)
Spider-Girl 015
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
The Buzz 2 (Pages 9+)
Spider-Girl 023
The Buzz 3 (Pages 1-5)
Spider-Girl 024
Spider-Girl One-Half
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 051
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050

KOLECKI, MAUVE
Spider-Girl 050

KUROYAMA
Wild Thing 2 Story 1

LADYHAWK
Spider-Girl 006
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 023
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 046

LOKI
A-Next 01

LU, NANCY "LUCKY"
Spider-Girl 023
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043

MAGNETA
J2 06 Story 1
J2 08

MAINFRAME
A-Next 01
A-Next 02
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
J2 05
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
A-Next 06
A-Next 07
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 046

MANSFIELD, MOOSE
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 006
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 012
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 015
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 019
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 023
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 050

MILLER, BRAD
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 010
Spider-Girl 012
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

MISERY/MELISSA CARSDALE
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 1 (Pages 1-25)

MISTER ABNORMAL
Spider-Girl 015
Spider-Girl 025

MISTER FANTASTIC/REED RICHADS
Fantastic Five 1
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3

MISTER FANTASTIC/REED RICHARDS
Spider-Girl 007 (Pages 21-22)
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Fantastic Five 4

MISTER NOBODY
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043

MONGRAIN, ALISON
Spider-Girl 048-FB1 (Page 6, panels 2-3)
Spider-Girl 048-FB2 (Page 9)
Spider-Girl 049-FB1 (Page 1, panels 2, 4, and 6)
Spider-Girl 049-FB2 (Page 7, panels 2+)
Spider-Girl 049-FB3 (Page 9, panel 2 thru Page 10, panel 3)
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

MS. FANTASTIC/LYJA
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Spider-Girl 003
A-Next 05
Fantastic Five 1
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4
Fantastic Five 5
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 034

MS. MARVEL 2/SHARON VENTURA GRIMM
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Fantastic Five 3

NELSON, FOGGY
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 017

NEMESUS
J2 04

NOBLE, HEATHER
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 050

NOVA
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panel 3)
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 042

OCTOPOD
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)

OSBORN, LIZ
Spider-Girl 000

OVERMAN
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

PARKER, AUNT MAY
Spider-Girl 010-TT (Page 9, panel 3 through Page 20)
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)

PARODY
J2 07 Story 3

PHILIPS, CHARLIE
Spider-Girl 044

PINCER/SCOTT LANG (ALTERNATE EARTH)
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

PRESIDENT OF THE U.S.
Spider-Girl 031

PROFESSOR X/CHARLES XAVIER
J2 07-FB1 (Pages 6-8)

PSI-LORD/FRANKLIN RICHARDS
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Spider-Girl 003
A-Next 05
Spider-Girl 006
Spider-Girl 010
Fantastic Five 1
Spider-Girl 013
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4
Fantastic Five 5
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047

QUICKWIRE
Spider-Girl 053

RAGONE, TURTLE
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 045

RAPTOR/BRENDA "BLACKIE" DRAGO
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

RED QUEEN/HOPE PYM
A-Next 07
A-Next 10
A-Next 12

RED SKULL (ALTERNATE EARTH)
A-Next 10-FB

RICHARDS (ALTERNATE EARTH), REED
A-Next 11

ROBERTSON, DR. RICHIE
The Buzz 1-FB1 (Page 4, panel 3 thru page 9)
The Buzz 1
The Buzz 2 (Pages 1-8)
The Buzz 2 (Pages 9+)
The Buzz 3 (Pages 1-5)
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 050

ROBINSON, TRACI
Spider-Girl 041

ROLLERBLAST
J2 01
J2 07 Story 1

RUDOLPHO, THEO
Spider-Girl 018

RUIZ, CAPTAIN
Spider-Girl 036

S.S. AGENT/JOHN WALKER
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

SABRECLAW
J2 08
A-Next 12
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 025

SAPRISTI (ALTERNATE EARTH), MARIA
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

SAPRISTI, MARIA
A-Next 09

SCARLET SPIDER 1/BEN REILLY
Spider-Girl 044 (Page 15, panels 3 and 5)

SCARLET SPIDER 2/FELICITY HARDY
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 052
Spider-Girl 053

SCARLET WITCH
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)
A-Next 07-FB3 (Pages 18-19)
A-Next 08
A-Next 10

SENTRY 666
A-Next 02

SHIELD AGENT 33
A-Next 04
A-Next 06

SIMIAN
J2 01
J2 07 Story 1

SIRYN
J2 07-FB1 (Pages 6-8)

SLIPPERY SAM
J2 04

SPANNER
J2 01
J2 07 Story 1

SPEEDBALL/ROBBY BALDWIN
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panel 3)
A-Next 01
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 015

SPIDER-GIRL/MAY "MAYDAY" PARKER
Spider-Girl 010-TT (Page 9, panel 3 through Page 20)
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)
Spider-Girl 048-FB2 (Page 9)
Spider-Girl 049-FB1 (Page 1, panels 2, 4, and 6)
Spider-Girl 049-FB2 (Page 7, panels 2+)
Spider-Girl 048-FB4 (Page 19, panel 1)
Spider-Girl 049-FB4 (Page 14, panels 2-4)
Spider-Girl 049-FB5 (Page 16, panel 3 thru Page 19, panel 4)
Spider-Girl 007 (Pages 21-22)
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 005
Spider-Girl 006
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 008
J2 07 Story 2
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 010
Spider-Girl 011
Spider-Girl 012
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 1 (Pages 1-25)
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 4 (Pages 47 thru 48)
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 5 (Pages 49-55)
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 015
Fantastic Five 3
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 019
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
The Buzz 2 (Pages 9+)
Spider-Girl 023
The Buzz 3 (Pages 1-5)
Spider-Girl 024
Spider-Girl One-Half
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 051
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052
Spider-Girl 053

SPIDER-MAN 1/PETER PARKER
Spider-Girl 010-TT (Page 9, panel 3 through Page 20)
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)
Spider-Girl 044 (Page 15, panels 3 and 5)
Spider-Girl 049-FB5 (Page 16, panel 3 thru Page 19, panel 4)
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 005
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 010
Spider-Girl 011
Spider-Girl 012
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 1 (Pages 1-25)
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 024
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 051
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

SPIDER-MAN 3/GERRY DREW
Spider-Girl 039-FB (Page 15, panel 4)
Spider-Girl 040-FB1 (Pages 13-14)
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043

SPIDER-SLAYER
Spider-Girl 010-TT (Page 9, panel 3 through Page 20)
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)

SPIDER-VENOM
Spider-Girl 005

SPIDER-WOMAN 1/JESSICA DREW
Spider-Girl 039-FB (Page 15, panel 4)
Spider-Girl 040-FB1 (Pages 13-14)
Spider-Girl 033
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043

SPIDER-WOMAN 2/JULIA CARPENTER
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043

SPILLANE, SERGEANT
Spider-Girl 050

SPYRAL
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 010
Spider-Girl 011

STEEL SPIDER
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panel 3)
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panels 4 thru 5)
Spider-Girl 032

STINGER/CASSANDRA "CASSIE" LANG
A-Next 01
A-Next 02
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
J2 05
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
Spider-Girl 009
A-Next 06
A-Next 07
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11
A-Next 12
Spider-Girl 013
Fantastic Five 5
Spider-Girl 016
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046

STORMTROOPER/ERIC MASTERSON
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

SUB-MARINER/NAMOR
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)

SUPEROID
Fantastic Five 2

SUPER-STORM/TORUS STORM
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 5

SWORDSMASTER
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

THE BUZZ/JACK JAMESON
The Buzz 1-FB1 (Page 4, panel 3 thru page 9)
The Buzz 1-FB1 (Page 4, panel 3 thru page 9)
Spider-Girl 012
The Buzz 1-FB2 (Page 10)
The Buzz 1
The Buzz 2 (Pages 1-8)
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 4 (Pages 47 thru 48)
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 019
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
The Buzz 2 (Pages 9+)
Spider-Girl 023
The Buzz 3 (Pages 1-5)
Spider-Girl 024
The Buzz 3 (Pages 6+)
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052

THING/BEN GRIMM
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Spider-Girl 003
A-Next 05
Fantastic Five 1
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4
Fantastic Five 5
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 034

THOMPSON, FLASH
Spider-Girl 010-TT (Page 9, panel 3 through Page 20)
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 016
Spider-Girl 023
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 052

THOR
A-Next 01

THRASH BANDIT
Wild Thing 1

THUNDERSTRIKE 2/KEVIN MASTERSON
A-Next 01
A-Next 02
Spider-Girl 000
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
J2 05
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
A-Next 06
A-Next 07
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

TIGRA
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)

TORQUE
J2 01
J2 07 Story 1

TYRUS THE TERRIBLE
A-Next 01

URICH, MEREDITH
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 026

VIBRAXAS/N'KANO
A-Next 04

VISION
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)

VULTURE
Spider-Girl 018

WASP/JANET VAN DYNE PYM
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)

WATSON PARKER, MARY JANE
Spider-Girl 011-TT (Pages 1-19)
Spider-Girl 048-FB2 (Page 9)
Spider-Girl 048-FB3 (Page 10, panels 5-6)
Spider-Girl 048-FB4 (Page 19, panel 1)
Spider-Girl 049-FB4 (Page 14, panels 2-4)
Spider-Girl 007 (Pages 21-22)
Spider-Girl 000
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 005
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 008
J2 07 Story 2
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 011
Spider-Girl Annual 1 Story 1 (Pages 1-25)
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 015
Spider-Girl 017
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 024
Spider-Girl 026
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 051
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 041
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 048
Spider-Girl 050
Spider-Girl 052
Spider-Girl 053

WENDIGO
Wild Thing 0

WILD THING/RINA LOGAN
J2 05
J2 06 Story 2
J2 07 Story 2
J2 08
J2 09 Story 2
Wild Thing 0
Wild Thing 1
Wild Thing 2 Story 1
Wild Thing 3 Story 1
Wild Thing 4 Story 1
Wild Thing 5 Story 1
Spider-Girl One-Half

WIZARD
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4

WOLVERINE
J2 07-FB1 (Pages 6-8)
J2 05
J2 09 Story 2
Wild Thing 0
Wild Thing 1
Wild Thing 4 Story 1

YAMA, CATHERINE
Spider-Girl 008

YAMA, JIMMY
Spider-Girl 001
Spider-Girl 002
Spider-Girl 003
Spider-Girl 004
Spider-Girl 006
Spider-Girl 007
Spider-Girl 008
Spider-Girl 009
Spider-Girl 011
Spider-Girl 012
Spider-Girl 013
Spider-Girl 014
Spider-Girl 018
Spider-Girl 019
Spider-Girl 020
Spider-Girl 022
Spider-Girl 023
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 027
Spider-Girl 028
Spider-Girl 029
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 035
Spider-Girl 036
Spider-Girl 037
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 039
Spider-Girl 040
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 050

YAMA, SACHI
J2 04
J2 05
Spider-Girl 008
J2 09 Story 1
Spider-Girl 014
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Wild Thing 5 Story 2

YI, SPIKE
Spider-Girl 024

ZAMORA, TALIA
J2 01
J2 04
J2 07 Story 3
J2 08
J2 09 Story 1
Wild Thing 3 Story 2
Wild Thing 4 Story 2

			*	*	*

MC2 Universe Team Chronology version 1.0
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 09, 2003 at 19:57:36:

Hi, all.

Here's the first version of my MC2 chronology. Keep in mind that I do not have access to issues 2-3 and 10-12 of J2. If anyone has scans to e-mail or wants to mail them to me, please contact me at jimmyflowers1@yahoo.com.

I will be adding the latest issues of Spider-Girl (54-59) once the final part of the current 6-part story is released.

NOTES:
FB = Flashback
TT = Time Travel

AVENGERS
Spider-Girl 032-FB2 (Page 14, panel 3)
A-Next 07-FB1 (Page 7, panel 2 through Page 8)
A-Next 07-FB2 (Pages 12-13)
A-Next 07-FB3 (Pages 18-19)
A-Next 01
A-Next 02
Spider-Girl 000
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)
A-Next 04
J2 05
A-Next 05
J2 06 Story 1
A-Next 06
A-Next 07
A-Next 08
A-Next 09
A-Next 10
A-Next 11
A-Next 12
Spider-Girl 013
Wild Thing 4 Story 2
Spider-Girl 021
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 030
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 032
Spider-Girl 038
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046

BROTHERHOOD OF THE SCRIERS
Spider-Girl 049-FB2 (Page 7, panels 2+)
Spider-Girl 049-FB4 (Page 14, panels 2-4)
Spider-Girl 049-FB5 (Page 16, panel 3 thru Page 19, panel 4)

DEFENDERS
A-Next 03 (Up to Page 20, panel 2)
A-Next 03 (Page 20, panel 3+)

DOOMBOTS
A-Next 05

FANTASTIC FIVE
Fantastic Five 4-FB1 (Page 5, panel 3 through Page 15 and Pages 18-19)
Spider-Girl 003
A-Next 05
Fantastic Five 1
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4
Spider-Girl One-Half
Spider-Girl 025
Spider-Girl 031
Spider-Girl 034
Spider-Girl 045
Spider-Girl 046
Spider-Girl 047
Spider-Girl 049
Spider-Girl 050

FANTASTIC FOUR
Spider-Girl 007 (Pages 21-22)

KREE
A-Next 02

NEW WARRIORS
Spider-Girl 042
Spider-Girl 043
Spider-Girl 044
Spider-Girl 046

N'GARAI
Wild Thing 4 Story 1

REVENGERS
A-Next 12

SAVAGE SIX
Spider-Girl 025

SENTINELS
Wild Thing 3 Story 1

SHIELD
Spider-Girl 005
A-Next 05
A-Next 06
Fantastic Five 2

SOLDIERS OF THE SERPENT
A-Next 04
A-Next 09
Spider-Girl 019
Spider-Girl 032

TAG TEAM
Wild Thing 4 Story 2

THUNDER GUARD
A-Next 10
A-Next 11

TROLLS
A-Next 01

WIZARD'S WARRIORS
Fantastic Five 2
Fantastic Five 3
Fantastic Five 4

X-MEN
J2 07-FB1 (Pages 6-8)

X-PEOPLE
J2 01
J2 07 Story 1

			*	*	*

2099 chronology...
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 09, 2003 at 19:58:59:

Hi, all.

Now that I've caught up on the Ultimate and MC2 lines, I'm going to begin work on a 2099 chronology. Any advice? Any existing notes to share? I'd love to hear what you think!

Take care,
Jimmy

			*	*	*

X chronology?
Posted by Caleb Monroe on May 09, 2003 at 23:59:08:

Is there somewhere where I can find a general X-books chronology guide?  In specific, I'm trying to catch up with what's happened to the former members of X-Force (the pre-X-Statix version) since the team disbanded.  I know Cannonball's appeared in New X-Men and X-treme X-Men, Siryn's showed in New X-Men, Proudstar and Feral also in New X-Men, and Tabitha Smith in Weapon X.  I'd like to find an X-chronology reading guide if I could, though, to get a sense of the order of all these shenanigans.  Thanks for your time.

			*	*	*

Re: X chronology?
Posted by bsl on May 15, 2003 at 01:30:04:
In Reply to: X chronology?
posted by Caleb Monroe on May 09, 2003 at 23:59:08:

try my site at: http://xmenguide.3utilities.com

			*	*	*

Re: X chronology?
Posted by Caleb Monroe on May 15, 2003 at 16:34:45:
In Reply to: Re: X chronology?
posted by bsl on May 15, 2003 at 01:30:04:

Thanks for the link.  I'll be sure to schuss over there and give it a look.

			*	*	*

Re: X chronology?
Posted by Caleb Monroe on May 15, 2003 at 16:52:12:
In Reply to: Re: X chronology?
posted by bsl on May 15, 2003 at 01:30:04:

I realize now these posts can't be edited.  Oh well.  Thank you again; that was just the sort of thing I was looking for.

			*	*	*

Apocolypse mistake; Classic X-Men#25/ X-Men Classic/Marvel Tales original material
Posted by John McDonagh</a> on May 11, 2003 at 15:38:18:

UX 119-FB-BTS
CX 25-FB
   Okay in the original story in UX 119, we see a shadowy figure talking to Moses Magnum; this figure gives Magnum the powers that Magnum uses to fight the X-Men in that issue.
   Then around 1989, this story was reprinted, and a page of new material was added in that showed Apocolypse as the entity that gives Magnum his powers. 
   Problem; whoever put in that page of New Material that shows Apocolypse as responsible for giving Moses Magnum his powers made a mistake; it was revealed that Tyrannus was responsible for Magnum receiving his powers in Incredible Hulk I#240-243! This was even noted in the original Index to the X-Men in the 1980s!

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/eldorado.htm

   (I guess they did not think of checking an unrelated, non-X book, and though it was a dangling plotline that had not been resolved.)

      Actually, Classic X-Men/X-Men Classic and Marvel Tales were pesky in adding in original material now and then. The Trapster and the Wizard appear in a new story in Marvel Tales#255 (or thereabouts) set immediately after Marvel Team-Up#58. 

			*	*	*

DET. "RUSTY" NALES...NAMELESS ONE...NANNY II
Posted by Arthur Stein on May 13, 2003 at 16:44:03:

:) 

new entries marked **

NALES, DET. REBECCA "RUSTY"
C&D3 3
** C&D3 5
C&D3 7

NAMELESS ONE
SUB-M 22
H2 126
**DEF 1
**DEF 3
**DEF 20
DRSTR3 41

NANNY II
XF 31
**XF 33
XF 34

Note to newcomers. Just to explain what my postings areas an avid Marvelist I had my own version of this Marvel Chronology Project (MCP). I am now comparing the two, and for all character entries in the MCP, I am checking if I have any appearances that may have been overlooked. Validating them. Chronologizing them. Posting them (so others have an opportunity to refute or comment). The aim... to help in the completeness of this magnificent piece of information engineering! 

#85

			*	*	*

Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
Posted by Jeph! on May 14, 2003 at 03:39:40:

After reading the last few weeks' worth of X-books, and getting some new clues, I thought I'd throw some new ideas on how the past years' worth of books fit together.

I've tried to model this after Paul's style of calendar, but it should be made clear that, to me, relative order is much more important than assigning dates to everything.  In some cases I've assigned various events to days of the week, but I haven't got the conceit to set actual DATES to events.  Some of this info has been directly LIFTED from Paul's calendar  I hope he doesn't mind.

This is by no means perfect, and input is always welcome.  Go to town!

-Jeph!

--------

X-TREME X-MEN #19
Two days.  Jean tells the Cassandra Nova story (ending in X #126) like it's new; Beast comments that Prof. X "is walking again"  which places it after X #127, as we've decided that Prof. X didn't have the strength to walk between X #126-127 (as seen in "the Order" #5-6).  Topical reference to Thanksgiving, which can be assumed to mean the X-Men are "giving thanks" that they're all alive and well and together for a brief time.

----
X-MEN UNLIMITED #43 (first story)
Sunspot called Cannonball, so this story can't occur between X #130 and XX #24, a period of "months" where Sam is off-earth.  Given that this story was written and drawn several months before it was published, I place Sam's appearance here BEFORE he quits X-Corp, rather than after.

----
MEKANIX #1-6 (?)
Several days or weeks, taking place between XX #19 and #25.  Kitty has recently received and thrown away a letter in #1 reminding her of her academic probation (from XU #36/1), and her first therapy session with Dr. Lyszinski is shown  therefore this is shortly after XX #19, which in turn is shortly after XU #36.  As for calendar placements, this is all during a college semester.  More info to come when I've bought and read the whole series.

----
Tuesday

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE #1 pp.1-4
XXX #10-18 were "a few weeks back".  The executive producer of "Spotlight" assigns two sets of reporters to get dirt on the X-Treme X-Men.  From here, it takes Neal and Manoli " a whole week" to get the X-Men's address (p.6), so this sequence takes place a week before.

----
Friday?

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #1 pp.5
Reporters visit X-Corp in Paris, trying to speak to Prof. X or Archangel, both of whom are implied to be in Paris at that time.  Probably at least two days after pp.1-4, as one reporter "called yesterday"  unless he called the day he got the assignment.  Shortly before X #128-130, as THESE reporters make no mention of the Chunnel incident, and the lobby (attacked by troops in X #129) is spotless.  Also, by X #131, Archangel is back at the school.

----
Monday

NEW X-MEN #128-130
One day, mostly at night.  Jean and Prof. X have begun their FIRST worldwide trip on X-Corp's behalf, beginning in Paris.  Weapon XII crashes a train in the Channel Tunnel, and Darkstar is killed.

----
Tuesday

X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp. 1-6
Cannonball helps the rescue workers at the Channel Tunnel crash site, the day after the accident (and probably same day as XXX #1 pp.6-13).  The other X-Men are leaving the scene, so this is likely early morning.

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #1 pp.6-7
After XXX #1 pp.5.  Neal and Manoli reference "the incident in the Channel Tunnel", placing this after X #130, and they make a number of phone calls to try to track down the X-Men.  Manoli confirms an appointment with Valerie Cooper's secretary "for tomorrow", so this page takes place during normal business hours.  Neal and Manoli's clothes don't change, so it's likely all the same day.  They finally get an address  it took them "a whole week".  Meanwhile, on p.7, the other reporters visit the X-Mansion

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #2 pp.3-4 (FB)
and are dunked in the lake by Esme of the Cuckoos.  Time-code on the camera footage reads "13:34.27.03"  this either means they've shot over 13 hours of footage (I don't think any tape holds that much) or it's 1:34 pm.

----
Wednesday

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #1 pp.8-13
Neal and Manoli arrive in New Orleans  Logan says it is "morning" and the reporters' clothes are different, placing this very probably the day after XXX #1 p.6.  By the way, Manoli still has an appointment with Val Cooper today, so it's unlikely that they traveled directly out to California from here.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp. 7-14
Cannonball is STILL volunteering.  News reports say that no survivors have been found for over 24 hours, and a survivor was found on p.4  so this is likely the evening of the day after pp.1-6, and TWO days after X #130.

----
Thursday

WOLVERINE v2 #183 (second story)
Using the passage of time the books give us, Storm leaves for Genosha on this date, three days before X #132.  Therefore, one can assume Logan left for Madripoor on the same date.  It's odd, given that Ororo is portrayed as unwell in XXX #1 pp.8-13 and walking in X #132, but it is consistent with all her other appearances showing her to be healing but impatient, and constantly overexerting herself (walking, trying to fly, etc.).  In any event, I needed a rationale for Logan to travel to the Madripoor area of the world.  Having him hear of the whereabouts of Lady Deathstrike, whom he'd vowed to find and kill for what she did in W2 #173-176, seemed like a good impetus.  He could have then traveled to Madripoor the next day, or later that same day.

----
Friday

X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp.15-16
"Much, MUCH later", all bodies have been accounted for.  Given the time-references between Storm appearing in New Orleans in XXX #1 and "three days later" in Genosha in X #132, this sequence must be TWO days after pp.7-14.

----
Saturday

NEW X-MEN #131 pp.1-3
Darkstar's funeral.  Going by XX #24, it's been five days since X #130.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp.17-18
"The next morning" after pp.15-16, Cannonball attends Darkstar's funeral, in a scene ripped from X #131.  Prof. X accepts Sam's resignation from X-Corp.

NEW X-MEN #131 pp.4-21
Archangel is blue here, placing it before UX #410.  Logan has most recently been in Madripoor, according to Cyclops (and he's likely being dropped off in Afghanistan here).  It's the first time Scott and Jean have been together for "weeks" (since X #127).

X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp.18-19
The night of Darkstar's funeral, Sam leaves Earth with Lila Cheney, and doesn't return for "months".

----
Sunday

NEW X-MEN #132
Sabra says she "should have stayed in Paris with X-Corp" and that this has been "the worst weekend of her life"  since Sabra isn't a MEMBER of X-Corp Paris, this must refer to the only time she was ever in Paris with them; X #131  which in turn implies that X #131-132 take place over the same "weekend".  Storm has been in Genosha for "three days", meaning she left on the date I've placed W2 #183/2.  We see her walk, manipulate clouds and fly (with the aid of her cape to catch the wind)  that's one hell of a recovery.  Prof. X and Jean are "on their way to India".  Since France, Genosha, and India are NOT in a straight line, I have to assume that they're following a planned itinerary of X-Corp locales.

----
NEW X-MEN #133
Shortly after X #132.  Prof. X and Jean arrive in India via commercial aircraft.  Wolverine travels separately from Afghanistan to meet them there.  Given that Logan's recently left Storm in poor health, and they're both in the same general area of the world, it makes sense that he'd offer to meet her in Japan before he to use that country's spas and check up on her (see XU #39/2).

----
WOLVERINE: NETSUKE #1-4
One night?  Wolverine follows his dreams of Mariko's spirit to a set of four carved figurines.  This series must be placed before Wolverine is ordered out of Japan in XU #39/2.

----
X-MEN UNLIMITED #39 (second story)
Storm and Logan rendezvous in Japan, but are ordered out by Sunfire (who likely appears here after X #133, given that he and Logan don't seem to be at odds with each other then).  The costume Storm wears here is never seen again.  She can fly and maneuver quite well, but just like in X #132, she seems to need her cape to catch the winds.

----
PUNISHER vol.6 #16-17
One night.  Wolverine is in Manhattan, drinking and in a bad mood.  I'm placing it just after XU #39/2 to try to link Logan's foul mood in this issue to his being recently legally barred from entering the country he loves.  Also, relative publication order places these before W2 #177, where Wolvie is also in NYC (but not the mansion).  A closer analysis of the Punisher series might show a different placement for these issues, but I doubt it.

----
WOLVERINE v2 #177-178
Logan, in NYC (but not the mansion) is embroiled in a battle with evil Catholics.  He travels to the Vatican and ultimately fails to save his friend's life.  Placement based on relative publication order.  More info to come.

----
WOLVERINE v2 #179-180
Logan travels from the X-Mansion to Canada to aid Alpha Flight in defeating a demon and training Earthmover, Shaman's replacement (placing this before XU #45).  Placement based on relative publication order.  More info to come.

----
UNCANNY X-MEN #410-413
One evening and the next morning.  Prof. X, Jean, and Logan are back from their travels  Prof. X is in Canada, inviting Sammy Pare to the school, Jean is at home with Scott, and Logan is on a mission to Cassidy Keep (incorrectly referred to as "Scotland"  it's in Ireland).  It's discovered that Havok is alive.  Archangel loses his blue skin.  Husk is now working/living at the school (last seen in Paris in UX #401-407).  Annie arrives at the mansion with Carter, presumably invited by Cyclops, and gets pulled into being a triage nurse for the wounded X-Men.  It's two weeks or more before UX #415.

----
Thursday-Saturday?

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #1 pp.14-23
The executive producer of "Spotlight" is now working on a rough cut of the expose.  Neal and Manoli interview Bishop and Sage in Valle Soleada (outside LA), a meeting set up by Storm.

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #2 pp.1-18
It looks like it's the evening of the same day as XXX #1 pp.14-23.  Neal and Manoli are still in Valle Soleada, talking to the same cop they rescued in XXX #1.  By huge coincidence, they run into Rogue and Gambit in the same town as Bishop and Sage.  It's "about a week"  six to eight days  before pp.19-22.

----
X-MEN UNLIMITED #42 (second story)
Dani Moonstar goes on a skiing date.  Placed here completely arbitrarily to highlight the fact that several days are passing between XXX #2 p.18 and UX #414.

----
Thursday

UNCANNY X-MEN #414
Prof. X recruits Northstar.  Archangel is still in casts.  Stacy X calls UX #410-413 "the other day", but she's always practiced lazy language  clues in #415 tell us it's been over a week since #413.

----
Friday

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE' #2 pp.19-22
"About a week" after XXX #2 pp.1-18.  Archangel's skin tone, hairstyle, and health match up to the period just before or just after UX #415.  Storm and Logan meet in NYC  he's likely checking in on her.  She can fly without the aid of her cape now.  The newspaper article here says "October", but the TV Guide on page 1 is for "June".  Which to believe?  I vote "neither".  We can at least believe, from the paper, that this is a "Friday".

----
Saturday

UNCANNY X-MEN #415
Bobby is surprised that Warren has healed so quickly.  Northstar is in the infirmary following his injuries in UX #414, which is referenced as "the other day"  although now it's been "weeks" since #410-413.  Therefore, it seems likely that Stacy's comment in #414 about #413 being "the other day" is untrustworthy.  Prof. X is not present  see X-Statix #6-8 for an idea where he might be.

X-TREME X-MEN #24  p.20
Cannonball returns to earth, and lives in Paris with Lila.  It is "months later, in the spring", but both parts of that sentence may have to be ignored.

X-STATIX #6-8
Prof. X is in Los Angeles, visiting a facility that he keeps there (is this part of X-Corporation L.A.?).  I place these issues here to try to explain where Prof. X was in XX #20-23, and why he had such trouble contacting the mansion telepathically.  Being 3000 miles away without a Cerebra machine might do it.

----
Sunday-Tuesday

X-TREME X-MEN #20-23
Three days?  Bishop and Sage investigate a young mutant who may have murdered seven people, however, he's found sanctuary at Xavier's and Emma Frost won't give him up.  Prof. X is off the mansion grounds for the first two days; see above for my theory on where he is.  Logan is in New Orleans (where I theorize he's been since meeting up with Storm in XXX #2 p.22.  While we've proven that Logan hasn't CONSISTENTLY been there through Storm's rehab, we can at least try to give the impression that when he IS there, he's there for long stretches of time uninterrupted.)  Logan is shown here just beginning to grow a goatee.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 p.21
Cannonball reads the events of XX #20-23 on the internet.  Bishop and Sage's involvement is public knowledge, so this is probably after day two, where they're teleported naked into Times Square.  Therefore, since Sam's bringing Lila breakfast, this is likely the morning of the third day (by which point things have returned to normal at the mansion, but the press has no way of knowing that yet).

----
Wednesday

UNCANNY X-MEN #416
UX #414 is listed as "a few days" ago  I have it at six days right now.  Sammy Pare STILL hasn't been assigned a room, and Prof. X still hasn't given him an orientation  but this could mean that Sammy asked for a single room and hasn't been switched yet, and we've seen that Prof. X is clearly very busy with meetings all over the globe.  At any rate, he hasn't made any friends yet, which is believable even though he's clearly been there for three weeks or more.  Sammy and the Juggernaut start to bond.  Glob Herman appears here, before his troubles with the Omega Gang in X #135-138.  Someone says that "Lorna will be there in the morning", so this is the day before UX #417-420.

----
Thursday

UNCANNY X-MEN #417-420
Lorna arrives, making this the day after UX #416.  Wolverine is back at the mansion, sporting a goatee.  Husk and Archangel battle Maximus Lobo and his werewolves, and Archangel discovers that his blood has amazing healing powers.  Havok wakes up from his coma.

----
Friday

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 pp.1-21
Everyone welcomes Havok back, making this probably the day after UX #417-420.  Lorna proposes to Havok.  Kurt decides to step down as co-leader of the X-Men and says he will leave on a vacation with Havok and Lorna.

----
CHAMBER #4
I don't have the issue, but the end scene features Chamber leaving ESU and rejoining Xavier's.   Paige's brooding about him in #417 probably places his return after that arc, ending in UX #421 p.21, and Sammy Pare's appearance in this scene places it before UX #422.  I personally place it before the Riot, simply because it's calmer.  UX #422 doesn't read as "Chamber returns to the school" so much as "Chamber walks by at an inopportune moment", so there can be some distance between his return and that issue.

----
X-MEN UNLIMITED #42 (first story)
Emma Frost is kidnapped by a diamond fetishist in Antarctica.  She escapes, kills her, and leaves.

----
WOLVERINE v2 #181-186
Over the course of a few days, Logan worms his way into, and destroys, a good chunk of the Jersey mobs.  He then faces the Punisher, who disapproves of Logan's solutions.  No goatee.

----
X-MEN UNLIMITED #44
One day.  Sammy Pare teaches the X-Men a lesson about animal rights.  Given that Sammy is friends with both Carter and the Juggernaut, this likely comes after UX #416  and therefore after #421 p.21, as well.  Kurt appears here, but he doesn't appear to be in a position of leadership, which is consistent with his status quo between UX #421 p.21 panels 1-2.  Scott and Jean are on good terms.  Logan appears with no goatee.

----
X-MEN UNLIMITED #45 pp.1-24
Three to four days.  Most of the issue takes place over one day, with the recovery scene on p.24 taking place "days" later.  A jealous co-worker nearly kills Guardian, and Heather Hudson gives birth.  Since Guardian was on the brink of death even BEFORE the house explosion, it's unlikely that he could have survived for "days".  It's likely, then, that Archangel was called up to heal him that very day  and it must have taken Guardian "days" to recover fully and regain consciousness.  Logan, Jean, and Warren all stick around until Guardian wakes up.  Logan has no goatee here.

----
Thursday

NEW X-MEN #134 pp.1-2
Jumbo Carnation is killed on the streets of Mutant Town, Alphabet City.  It seems to be a party night in the city, so I'm placing it on a Thursday night. 

----
Friday

NEW X-MEN #134 pp.3-22
The day after Jumbo is killed, the students react.  Jean is stated to be in Hong Kong  Cyclops says she'll "be home soon", which clearly isnt true, as she doesn't return for another two weeks.  I take this statement, then, to mean that she just left  Scott probably meant to say "she'll be home soon enough".

----
Sunday

NEW X-MEN #135 pp.1-14
Xavier says that he'll be opening the school's doors to humans in "three days' time", which X #138 confirms is a Wednesday.  That makes this a Sunday, and classes on a Sunday show us that Xavier's REALLY doesn't hold to traditional human school practices.  Jumbo Carnation was killed "the other night", another reason I place it on a Thursday.  Xorn's special class go camping, and Quentin forms the Omega Gang and kills some humans.

----
Monday

NEW X-MEN #135 pp.15-22
Prof. X has a telepathic conference with the X-Men about Quentin.  Jean reports in from Hong Kong.  Logan's psychic image has no goatee  however, when he shows up in #137, he's sporting one again.

----
Tuesday

NEW X-MEN #136 pp.1-21
The special class is attacked by U-Men.  Quentin and the Omega Gang capture Prof. X the night before Open Day.

----
Wednesday

NEW X-MEN #136 p.22
Open Day.  The riot begins.

NEW X-MEN #137
The riot continues.  Logan shows up, once again with a goatee.  Sophie of the Stepford Cuckoos dies.  Quentin is dealt a fatal injury.

NEW X-MEN #138 pp.1-6
Still Open Day, which is confirmed as a "Wednesday".  Cyclops, Beast, and Xorn round up Glob Herman.  Wolverine, with goatee, chews out the Omega Gang and tells them they'll be sent to a human jail.

----
Thursday

X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp.21
Cannonball reads about the Riot on the internet.  It says "ONE student" was killed, placing this before Quentin's death on X #138 p.11.

----
Friday

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 pp.21-23
Havok, Polaris, and Nightcrawler leave for an archaeological dig.  Prof. X and Cyclops are there to see them off, but Jean is not  consistent with her being in Hong Kong.  Moods seem too jovial for this to be the day after the riot, so I've placed it two days afterwards.

----
Sunday

UNCANNY X-MEN #422  FB
Stacy makes an XXX video for Archangel and leaves it in his VCR, then leaves the X-Men.

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 pp.23-24
"Two nights" after UX #421 pp.21-23.  Alpha Flight shows up, demanding custody of every child on the premises.

UNCANNY X-MEN #422
Alpha Flight and the NYC police show up in the wake of "the recent riot" to remove all the children for their own safety.  Heather has given birth, placing this after XU #45.  Emma is referenced as being alive, placing this before NX #139 pp.21.  Sammy leaves with Alpha Flight to go back home, placing this after Chamber #4.

----
Tuesday

NEW X-MEN #138 pp.7-9
"Tuesday".  Requiem for Sophie.  The Cuckoos say they'll be leaving "after the Prizegiving" (Saturday), but they end up staying until the day of school closing (next Wednesday).

----
Thursday

NEW X-MEN #138 pp.10-14
"Thursday".  Quentin Quire dies, and Prof. X announces that school will be closing "for the summer" in "six days' time" (meaning, next Wednesday).  That summer reference may have to go, or it could correlate with the "spring" reference in XX #24 p.20.

----
Friday

NEW X-MEN #138 p.15
"Friday".  Emma takes Angel clothes shopping.  This is referenced as "a few days" prior to X #139 pp.21-22 X #140  right now we have it at four days prior.

----
Saturday

NEW X-MEN #138 pp.16-23
"Saturday".  The prizegiving ceremony.  Angel tells Beak she is pregnant.  Jean returns home from Hong Kong with Dust, and finds Emma and Scott in a psychic affair.

NEW X-MEN #139 pp.1-20
Following directly from X #138 pp.16-23.  The Cuckoos say that "school is over for the summer", implying that classes have already ended, even though the school is not to close down until Wednesday.  Logan has shaved his goatee from last Wednesday.

----
Tuesday

NEW X-MEN #139 pp.21-22
Emma's diamond body is found shattered.

----
Wednesday

NEW X-MEN #140 pp.1-14
Bishop institutes a lockdown of the mansion grounds, one that likely began last night after Emma's body was found.  That afternoon, the Cuckoos gripe that "school ought to have closed by now", but since they were still there when the lockdown hit, school hadn't closed before the lockdown  so this is likely the very Wednesday that Xavier's was to close.  Archangel and Nightcrawler are present, meaning that Kurt has returned from his expedition (he left 12 days ago, that seems like about enough time).

----
Thursday

NEW X-MEN #140 pp.15-22
The next day, given the clocks on the walls.  The murder investigation continues.  Sage finds a cabin full of what are presumably Angel's larval babies.

NEW X-MEN #141
Likely the same day as #140.  We'll see.

----
X-TREME X-MEN #24 pp.22-23
Cannonball meets with Storm (who flies to Paris, still in her miniskirt from XX #23), and volunteers to join the X-Treme Team.

----
WOLVERINE v2 #187-189
Logan puts down a country serial-killer, and assists in a murder investigation, all sans goatee.  Relative publication order, more info to come.

----
UNCANNY X-MEN #423-424
One day, "weeks" after UX #422.  Logan is at the mansion, in his newest of outfits (black with yellow tiger-stripes), sans goatee.  More info to come.

----
X-TREME X-MEN #25-28
The X-Treme Team and Logan (sans goatee) are in Cumberland, Kentucky.  More info to come.

----
MYSTIQUE #1-6
I'm placing this last because, of all the currently-running story arcs, it's a six-parter and it's going to end last.  Jean Grey, Prof. X and Forge guest-star.  Prof. X goes on Nightline.

--------
NOT INCLUDED:

HULK / WOLVERINE: SIX HOURS #1-4  this could go just about anywhere in Logan's chronology, and really depends on how it falls (earlier or later) into the Hulk's timeline.

WOLVERINE / DOOP #1-2, WOLVERINE: SNIKT! #1-6  too early to tell.

WOLVERINE: X-ISLE #1-5  didn't buy it.  Will comment once I get the TPB.

X-STATIX #1-5, 9-10 - I just plain don't collect it, and can't comment.

X-MEN UNLIMITED:
XU #41/1 takes place in an alternate universe.
XU #41/2 is an X-Statix story; see above.
XU #41/3 doesn't feature any established characters  I don't CARE where it falls.
XU #42/3 takes place between UX #31-32.
XU #42/4 takes place before Xavier could walk again, therefore likely before X #114, the start of the arc where his spine is healed.
XU #43/2 features Kitty missing and presumed dead, and Lockheed badly injured  this doesn't correspond to any other story I've ever read, so I'm going to shrug and throw it into the shallow end of the six-month gap between UX #380 and X #100.

			*	*	*

Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
Posted by Paul O'Brien on May 14, 2003 at 08:35:18:
In Reply to: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
posted by Jeph! on May 14, 2003 at 03:39:40:

Nice work.  Some quick comments:-

I strongly encourage you not to spend money on Wolverine: X-Isle, which is absolute drek.  Suffice to say that the story is stated to take no more than two days.  Logan loses his temper at a carnival in New York while out with Amiko, and for reasons best known to the writer proceeds to fly out to a remote island to gratuitously hallucinate for two days.  Utter tripe, and not worth spending money on.

In any event, it can fit in anywhere that Wolverine has two days free and is around the New York are.

As for the Lockheed story in XU 43/2, I gather that the intention behind this story was to explain Lockheed's absence in Mekanix #1-6.  The idea is that Kitty and Lockheed become separated in an unpublished story.  Kitty heads off to the US without Lockheed; Lockheed can't follow until he's told where she is at the end of the story.  

The glitch is that Lockheed can be seen in the background of some earlier stories showing Kitty at university.  Lockheed's appearance here must immediately precede his first appearance with Kitty in the USA; unfortunately, that still doesn't explain where he was during Mekanix.

			*	*	*

XU #43/2 - Lockheed.
Posted by Jeph!</a> on May 14, 2003 at 11:39:51:
In Reply to: Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
posted by Paul O'Brien on May 14, 2003 at 08:35:18:

> Nice work.

Thanks!  And thanks for the heads-up on "X-Isle" -- now I don't have to spend $12 to discover that it takes place over two days.

> As for the Lockheed story in XU 43/2, I gather that the intention behind this story was to explain Lockheed's absence in Mekanix #1-6 ... The glitch is that Lockheed can be seen in the background of some earlier stories showing Kitty at university.  Lockheed's appearance here must immediately precede his first appearance with Kitty in the USA; unfortunately, that still doesn't explain where he was during Mekanix.

So, what WERE Lockheed's most recent appearances?  He appeared with Kitty in, what, XX @'01/2, right?  And before that ... hmm, I'd have to say Excalibur #125.  I can't think of a time after that where he's appeared, although I could be wrong.

So, XU #43/2 takes place between EXCAL #125 and XX@'01/2 ... that's a hell of a gap.  But given that Lockheed is the only recurring character in this story, it really doesn't MATTER where on a calendar this falls, as long as it's between those two waypoints.

Actually, thinking about it, a better place then the Gap would be somewhere between X #100 and #110.  In X #100, Kitty makes earthfall in an alien armor and isn't seen again, and in #110 she shows up quite normally from the Chicago area to take custody of Peter's ashes.

Given that there's already an "untold Kitty story" in that gap, one which ends with her moving to Chicago, why not have the Lockheed story, where he and Kitty had an untold battle in Scotland(?) that led to them being separated and her moving to Chicago, fit in there?

There's no way this story can explain ALL of Lockheed's "missing periods" -- so why bother to pretend it's a satisfactory patch anyway?  Placing it between X #100-110 would at least be some sort of patch to KITTY'S story during that time...

Let me know what you think of this idea.

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Re: XU #43/2 - Lockheed.
Posted by Paul O'Brien on May 14, 2003 at 13:59:30:
In Reply to: XU #43/2 - Lockheed.
posted by Jeph! on May 14, 2003 at 11:39:51:

> So, what WERE Lockheed's most recent appearances?  He appeared with Kitty in, what, XX @'01/2, right?  And before that ... hmm, I'd have to say Excalibur #125. 

Yes.

> I can't think of a time after that where he's appeared, although I could be wrong.

According to my notes, he also puts in a very brief appearance in X-Men Unlimited #38 (the one about Kitty getting over the death of Colossus).

> Given that there's already an "untold Kitty story" in that gap, one which ends with her moving to Chicago, why not have the Lockheed story, where he and Kitty had an untold battle in Scotland(?) that led to them being separated and her moving to Chicago, fit in there?

Oddly, this particular battle seems to have taken place in England.  It's a very strange attempt to bridge a continuity gap, and placing it exactly is almost impossible.  What can be said with certainty is that Kitty must already be living in Chicago by this point (because that's where Lockheed is sent at the end of the story), and the story must precede Lockheed's first appearance with Kitty in Chicago (because he doesn't know where she is until the end of the story).  Other than that, it could literally go anywhere.

			*	*	*

Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 18, 2003 at 21:51:39:
In Reply to: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
posted by Jeph! on May 14, 2003 at 03:39:40:

> I've tried to model this after Paul's style of calendar, but it should be made clear that, to me, relative order is much more important than assigning dates to everything.  In some cases I've assigned various events to days of the week, but I haven't got the conceit to set actual DATES to events.  Some of this info has been directly LIFTED from Paul's calendar  I hope he doesn't mind.

I don't mind at all, Jeph.  I, in turn, have taken your material and reworked it into a slightly different order (but mostly the same), added a bunch of other X-related stories (such as X-Statix, X-Factor v2, Chamber, etc.), and, yes, stuck it all on a calendar with actual dates, which makes it easier for me to track the passage of time.

So, here you go...

Thursday, August 1

NEW X-MEN #127
One day.  A mutant community is starting to grow in Alphabet City.  Professor X is walking and Paris is probably rebuilding BTS.

Friday, August 2

X-FORCE #129 (20-22)
One day, probably a few days after XFO 129 (11-19), long enough for X-Force to be inundated with calls, e-mails and letters about the groups new name.  Orphan announces that X-Force is now X-Statix.

Saturday, August 3

X-TREME X-MEN #19 (1-18)
One day, not long after XX 18.  The Beast comments that Xavier is walking again, putting this issue after X 127.  Mention is made of the trouble that Kitty got into at school in XU 36/1.  Storm is in a wheelchair here, still recovering from injuries sustained in XX 18, so this story must occur before X 131, and most likely before X 128.  According to Jeph, Logan is here after DP2 69.  The reference to Thanksgiving season in the opening narrative must be topical  there is no reference to the holiday in the story, so it can be interpreted as meaning the X-Mens thanksgiving for surviving the Khan invasion.

X-FACTOR v2 #2 (13-14)
One day.  Tony Robb has his 72nd homer of the season on a balmy summer night in Baltimore.

Sunday, August 4

X-TREME X-MEN #19 (19-21)
The morning after XX 19 (1-18).  The reunited X-Men go their separate ways, with Kitty heading back to Chicago for classes (probably summer classes, in MEK 1), Neal and Heather leaving to find her brother, Rogue and Gambit deciding to take some R&R, and Jean, Kurt, and Hank going back to Westchester.  Logan stays with Ororo in New Orleans after this, and we see them next in XXX 1 (8-13). 

Monday, August 5

X-FACTOR v2 #2 (15-19p1)
One day.  Tony Robb goes for his 73rd homer and is shot by Earl Whitacker, who is subdued by Nightcrawler.  It is a week before XF2 2 (19-22).

Tuesday, August 6

X-STATIX #1/1 (1-13)
One day.  Arnie Lundberg laments the passing of Edie Sawyer.  Meanwhile, X-Statix finishes a mission then watches a popular new TV show starring O-Force.  Green trees in California.

Wednesday, August 7

X-STATIX #1/1 (14-16p5)
The day after XS 1/1 (1-13).  Orphan, Anarchist, and Doop check out new recruits for X-Statix and meet Venus Dee Milo.  Doop is given an assignment to deal with the unstable recruit, Corkscrew.  It is five days before XS 1 (16-23).

MEKANIX #1 (1)
In the aftermath of Kittys altercation in XU 36/1, she and her entire advanced physics tutorial class appear as targets on the Purity website on a Wednesday night.

Thursday, August 8

X-STATIX #1/2 (1)
Probably the day after XS 1/1 (14-16).  Doops assignment with Corkscrew finds them alone in the woods.

MEKANIX #1 (15-23)
The day after MEK 1 (3-14).  Shola Inkosi, a Genoshan student at the University of Chicago, is haunted by the destruction of his homeland.  Kitty and her fellow students in Dr. Benes physics tutorial run a test, but the experiment is sabotaged by anti-mutant students so that the mutant they suspect will be exposed.

MEKANIX #2 (1-16)
The same night as MEK 1 (15-23).  Kitty, Shan, and Shola contain the disaster caused by the lab sabotage and Shola is revealed publicly as a mutant in the process.  Full moon.

Friday, August 9

X-STATIX #1/2 (2-3)
The day after XS 1/2 (1).  More Doop and Corkscrew in the woods.

MEKANIX #2 (17-23)
The day after MEK 2 (1-16).  Kitty has her second session with the psychiatrist on a Friday (see MEK 1).  Kitty is interrogated by the Chicago police about the lab sabotage.

MEKANIX #3
The same day as MEK 2 (17-23), a few months after X 115.  The FBI ransacks Kittys apartment, Kitty has a second 9 AM session in one day (continuity glitch?!), and then she pulls a double shift at the Belles of Hell.  Shan and her siblings are thrown out of their apartment after the FBI snoops around there.  Anti-mutant students attempt to kill Shola, but he, Kitty, and Shan rout them.

MEKANIX #4 (1-3)
The same night as MEK 3.  The freighter Amazon Belle arrives at Chicago.

Saturday, August 10

X-STATIX #1/2 (4-7)
The day after XS 1/2 (2-3).  Doop kills Corkscrew.  Doop appears next in XS 1/1 (16-17).

Monday, August 12

MEKANIX #4 (4-6)
One morning, days after MEK 3.  Kitty gets her apartment back and she and her friends clean up the mess.

X-FACTOR v2 #2 (19p2-23)
Tony Robb holds a press conference on a rainy day a week after XF2 2 (15-19).

X-STATIX #1/1 (16p6-17)
One day, five days after XS 1 (14-16).  Edie has been dead for weeks now, so it is weeks after XFO 128.  Orphans question to Doop about Code X suggests that this segment occurs after XS1/2 (4-7).  Orphan selects Venus Dee Milo as the new X-Statix member.

MEKANIX #4 (7)
The same night as MEK 4 (4-6).  A Sentinel of the freighter Amazon Belle strikes.

Tuesday, August 13

X-STATIX #1/1 (18-23)
The day after XS 1/1 (16-17).  An X-Statix press conference is upstaged by O-Forces first mission, broadcast live.  Arnie Lundberg works on his revenge as Guy gets to know Venus.  Green trees in California.  Venus is 19 years old, as she says she was eleven eight years ago.

X-STATIX #2 (1)
The same day as XS 1/1 (18-23).  O-Forces first mission is a success.

MEKANIX #4 (8-23)
The day after MEK 4 (7). Kitty has another 9 AM session with her psychologist.  Tom Moores loyalties are torn and Shola shows him his powers.  That night, Kitty and Shan battle and seemingly defeat a Sentinel from the Amazon Belle.

MEKANIX #5 (1-12)
The same night as MEK 4 (8-23).  Kittys and Shans battle with the Sentinel continues and concludes when Shola defeats it.

Wednesday, August 14

MEKANIX #5 (13-23)
The day after MEK 5 (1-12).  Kitty has another 9 AM session with her psychologist and reveals to her that shes a mutant.  That night, a student meeting is held to discuss a proposal to ban Purity as a terrorist hate group, and while this occurs, Sentinels show up.

MEKANIX #6 (1-20)
The same night as MEK 5 (13-23).  With help from Tom Moore, Kitty, Shan, and Shola defeat the Sentinels.  Purity leader Alice Tremaine salvages a damaged Sentinel.

Thursday, August 15

MEKANIX #6  FB (21p5-21p6)
The morning after MEK 6 (1-20).  Kitty, Shan, and Shola trace the Sentinels energy signature to the Amazon Belle and find it stripped.

MEKANIX #6 (21-23p4)
The same morning as MEK 6-FB.  Kitty has another session with her psychologist.  Alice Tremaine works on the salvaged Sentinel.

MEKANIX #6 (23p5-23p9)
The same night as MEK 6 (21-22).  Kitty joins her friends at the Belles of Hell.

Sunday, August 18

X-MEN UNLIMITED #41/2
One day.  Given Venus Dee Milos presence here as a member of X-Statix, it must be after XS 2 (1), and given Orphan has the costume he wore before he quit the team in XS 5 (8-22), it is likely before XS 2 (2-13).

Tuesday, August 20

X-TREME X-MEN X-POSE #1 (1-4)
One day, a few weeks after XX 18.  The executive producer of Spotlight assigns two sets of reporters to get dirt on the X-Treme X-Men.  It is a whole week before XX 1 (6-7).

Wednesday, August 21

CHAMBER #1 (1-12)
One day.  Chamber and Cyclops rescue a mutant boy and bring him to Xaviers.  They find out about mutant murders in a recent explosion at ESU, at which the fall sessions probably starting soon.  (This explosion is probably the one referenced in HOOD 1.)  Jono convinces Scott that he investigate the murders undercover as a newly enrolled student.

Thursday, August 22

X-FACTOR v2 #3
One day?  I dont have this issue, but according to a recap in XF2 4, there is a raid on the home of church-bombing, mutant-hater Kyle Nakamura, and the X-Men (including Jean Grey, Cyclops, and Beast) are present.  Details?

Friday, August 23

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #1 (5)
One day.  Reporters visit X-Corp in Paris, presumably because Xavier and Worthington are there, although they do not appear the whole day, so we dont know if their information is accurate.  Probably shortly before X 128-130, as these reporters make no mention of the Chunnel incident, and the lobby (attacked by troops in X 129) is spotless.  Also, by X 131, five days from now, Archangel is back at the school.

X-FACTOR v2 #4 (2-4/5p5)
The day after XF2 3.  Aaron Kearse and Catherine Gray return to Washington DC from the raid on Nakamuras home.  The publication date of the new News Time magazine is hard to read, but may be August 25, 2002.

Saturday, August 24

X-FACTOR v2 #4 (4/5p6-13)
In the early morning hours of the day after XF2 4 (2-4/5), Kearse and Gray go to Kendall Greens home in Reston, VA and uncover a plot to bomb Xaviers School.  There is a reference to Sept. 11 here.

X-STATIX #2 (2-13)
One day, shortly after XS 2 (1).  Arnie Lundberg menaces his Minnesota town, where we see green grass and trees.  While on a mission with X-Statix, Venus Dee Milo explodes.

X-FACTOR v2 #4 (14-19p3)
On the night of XF2 4 (2-13), Kearse and Gray arrive at Xaviers by car from Reston, VA.  They try to stop the bomber as the X-Men are watching the Osbournes on TV.  If that program airs the same time in the MU as in the real world, and assuming theyre not watching a taped episode, then its Sunday night.  As related later, Phoenix disassembles the bomb telekinetically and knocks out the bomber.  Then, while Kearse is unconscious, Hank McCoy provides him with a more natural prothesis.

Sunday, August 25

X-FACTOR v2 #4 (BTS)
Several hours after XF2 4 (14-19), the X-Men release Kearse and Gray at a press conference at which Nightcrawler is a spokesperson.

X-STATIX #2 (14-22)
The night of the day after XS 2 (2-13).  Reference is made to Edie not being dead four months, but the reference may be to four weeks since XFO 128.  Guy and Venus have an unpleasant dinner in a restaurant, then Sharon Ginsburg serves X-Statix a court order forbidding Venus from being on the team.  O-Force prepares to battle Arnie Lundberg.

X-STATIX #3 (1-7)
The same night as XS 2.  Sharon threatens to take X-Statix to court over Venus, Anarchist and Dead Girl leave to go on tour, and Vivisector has troubles.		

Monday, August 26

X-STATIX #3 (8-16)
The day after XS 3 (1-7).  Phat spends time at home, where we see green grass and trees and warm, outdoor grilling weather.  Orphan tries to talk O-Force out of their mission against Arnie Lundberg, who blows up his school, liberating the kids from the classroom.  This may be the first day of school for a new year in Arnies Minnesota town, where we see green grass and trees.  Orphan then checks out what must be the first performance of the Tike Alicar and Dead Girl Road Show.

X-FACTOR v2 #4 (19p4-20)
A whole day after XF2 4 (BTS), Kearse awakens in the hospital and Gray reconciles with her mother.  It is two days before XF2 4 (21-23).

NEW X-MEN #128
One night, most likely after XX 19.  Paris is rebuilt, placing this story sometime after UX 408.  Xavier and Jean are in Paris while on their first worldwide trip for X-Corp.

NEW X-MEN #129
The same night as X 128.

NEW X-MEN #130
The same night as X 129.  Darkstar dies.  This issue is referred to as having occurred yesterday in XX 24 (1-14).

Tuesday, August 27

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (1-6)
The day after X 130.  Cannonball assists with rescue and salvage efforts in the Chunnel and stays after the X-Men leave.

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #1 (6-7)
One day, a whole week after XXX 1 (1-4).  The incident in the Channel Tunnel is mentioned, so this segment must occur after X 130.  Conan and Wetherell get a tip to go to New Orleans.  At around 1:30 PM, according to the camera in XXX 2-FB (2-3), other reporters visit Emma Frost at Xaviers, where we see green foliage and warm weather; they are dumped in the lake.

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #2FB (2-3)
The same day as XXX 1 (5-7).  The dunked reporters retreat from Xaviers amid taunts from the students there.  Time-code on the camera footage reads 13:34.27.03, which may be a reference to it being 1:34 PM.

X-STATIX #3 (17-22)
The day after XS 3 (8-16).  O-Force goes up against 13-year-old Arnie Lunt and his resurrected corpses, and as things look bad, Orphan arrives.

X-STATIX #4 (1-18)
The same night as XS 3 (17-22).  X-Statix show up to help Orphan battle Arnie Lundberg.  Green grass and trees in Minnesota.

Wednesday, August 28

X-STATIX #4 (19-22)
The morning after XS 4 (1-18).  X-Statix is a team again, and Orphan introduces their newest member, Arnie Lundberg.

X-STATIX #5 (1)
The same morning as XS 4 (19-22).  X-Statix discusses Arnie in the john.

X-STATIX #5 (6)
The same morning as XS 5 (1).  More john talk about Arnie.

X-STATIX #5 (2-5)
The same morning as XS 5 (6).  Mysterious Fan Boy (an anonymous Arnie Lunt) is publicly presented as the newest member of X-Statix.  Green trees in California.

X-STATIX #5 (7-8)
The same morning as XS 6 (2-5).  As X-Statix have lunch, Lacuna drops by, curious about Mysterious Fan Boys identity.

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #1 (8-13)
Probably the day after XXX 1 (6-7), given that the reporters clothes are different and Logan says that its morning.  Conan and Wetherell visit Ororo and Logan in New Orleans, where the two X-Men have been since XX 19.  Manoli still has an appointment with Val Cooper today, so its unlikely that they traveled directly out to California from here.  Ororo is still wheelchair-bound, but she manages to stand and try to fly, despite the fact that she cant yet walk.  Some time should pass between this point and the point at which Logan leaves Ororo for Madripoor (before X 131) and Storm goes to Genosha (three days before X 132)  obviously it would take a while for Storm to get from the point shes at here to the apparent fitness (which we see in  X 132) that makes it easier for Logan to leave her. 

X-STATIX #5 (9-10p1)
The same day as XS 5 (7-8).  Lacuna uses her power to unmask Arnie.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (7-14)
Cannonball is still volunteering.  News reports say that no survivors have been found for over 24 hours, and a survivor was found on page 4, so this is likely the day after XX 24 (1-6), two days after X 130.

X-FACTOR v2 #4 (21-23)
One day, two days after XF2 4 (19-20).  An epilog for Kearse and Gray.  Green grass and trees.

CHAMBER #1 (13-23)
One day, one week after Chamber 1 (1-12).  Jono is enrolled at ESU at the beginning of the fall semester.  Green grass and trees.  It must be a Wednesday.  Full moon.

Thursday, August 29

CHAMBER #2
The day after CHAMBER 1 (13-23).  A rainy Thursday.

X-STATIX #5 (10p2-13)
The day after XS 5 (9-10).  X-Statix watch the media coverage of Arnies unmasking and decide to let him prove himself on a mission.  Orphan gets Lacuna to agree to deal with the situation.  Razorhead escapes from prison.

WOLVERINE v2 #183/2
Using the passage of time the books give us, Storm leaves for Genosha on this date, three days before X 132.  Therefore, one can assume Logan left for Madripoor on the same date. Its odd, given that Ororo is portrayed as unwell in XXX 1 (8-13) and walking in X 132, but it is consistent with all her other appearances showing her to be healing but impatient, and constantly overexerting herself (walking, trying to fly, etc.).  In any event, we need a rationale for Logan to travel to the Madripoor area of the world. Having him hear of the whereabouts of Lady Deathstrike, whom hed vowed to find and kill for what she did in W2 173-176, seemed like a good impetus.  He could have then traveled to Madripoor the next day or later that same day.

Friday, August 30

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (15-16)
The day after XX 24 (1-14).  Cannonball finishes his work at the Chunnel and leaves the scene.  Given the time-references between Storm appearing in New Orleans in XXX 1 (8-13) and three days later in Genosha in X  132, this sequence must be two days after XX 24 (7-14).

X-STATIX #5 (14-17)
The day after XS 5 (10-13).  X-Statix battles Razorhead, who is killed by Arnie.  Arnie is killed by Lacuna under orders from Orphan.

CHAMBER #3
The day after CHAMBER 2.  Green grass and trees and some falling leaves.  It is a Friday with a full moon.

Saturday, August 31

NEW X-MEN #131 (1)
One morning, probably a few days after X2 130.  Scott and Emma are flying in an X-jet.

NEW X-MEN #131 (2/3) ~ X-TREME X-MEN #24 (17p1-17p3)
The same morning as X 131 (1) and the morning after XX 24 (15-16), so it is four days after X 130.  The X-Men attend Darkstars funeral in a rainy Paris.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (17p4-18p2)
The same morning as XX 24 (17p1-17p3).  After the funeral, Cannonball quits X-Corp and Xavier gives him a playbill for a gig by Lila Cheney in Paris that night.

NEW X-MEN #131 (4-21)
The same day as X 131 (2/3).  Since Archangel (who is back at Xaviers now) is still blue here, this issue must occur before UX 410.  Logan has most recently been in Madripoor, according to Cyclops (and he's likely being dropped off in Afghanistan here).  It's the first time Scott and Jean have been together for weeks  since X 127.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (18p3-19)
The same night as XX 24 (17-18).  Cannonball reconnects with Lila Cheney and they teleport off Earth for some R&R.  It is technically months before XX 24 (20-21).

Sunday, September 1

NEW X-MEN #132
Probably the day after X 131.  A group of X-Men are on their way from the Paris funeral of Darkstar to India when the stop in Genosha, where Storm has been for three days (thus missing the funeral), so it is more than three days since XX 1 (8-13).  Storm appears to have recovered, or so she may deceive herself into believing  and with Logan having left her for an important reason (Vatican or Madripoor), she has decided to go off to Genosha,  A comment by Sabra about this being the worst weekend of her life suggests that X 131 occurs on Saturday and this issue on a Sunday.  Polaris returns.  According to the introductory notes in X 133, it is one year after the destruction of Genosha in X 115, but that length of time may be too long  six months may be more appropriate.

Monday, September 2

X-STATIX #5 (18-22)
One day, probably a few days after XS 5 (14-17), as we see Arnies funeral here.  Orphan and Lacuna argue on the beach and Orphan quits X-Statix.  Green trees in California.

NEW X-MEN #133
Probably the day after X 132, as the X-Men arrive in India via commercial aircraft.  Wolverine travels separately from Afghanistan to meet them there.  Both Logan and Sunfire appear here, and it is likely this is before their encounter in XU 39/2.  Given that Logan recently left Storm in poor health, and theyre both in the same general area of the world, it makes sense that hed offer to meet her in Japan around now to use that countrys spas and check up on her (see XU 39/2).  Full moon.

September (undetermined date)

WOLVERINE: NETSUKE #1-4
One night?  Wolverine follows his dreams of Marikos spirit to a set of four carved figurines.  This series must be placed before Wolverine is ordered out of Japan in XU 39/2.

September (undetermined date)

X-MEN UNLIMITED #39/2
One day.  Storm and Logan rendezvous in Japan (where we see green grass and trees), but are ordered out by Sunfire, who likely appears here after X 133, given that he and Logan dont seem to be at odds with each other then.  Sunfire, citing new laws against mutants, gives them 24 hours to leave.  The costume Storm wears here is never seen again.  She can fly and maneuver quite well, but just like in X 132, she seems to need her cape to catch the winds.

September (undetermined date)

PUNISHER v6 #16-17
One night.  Wolverine is in Manhattan, drinking and in a bad mood.  Placement just after XU 39/2 would provide a reason for Logans foul mood  being legally barred from the country he loves.  Relative publication order places these issues before W2 177, where Wolvie is also in NYC.

September (undetermined date)

WOLVERINE v2 #177-178
Logan is embroiled in battle with evil Catholics in New York City.  He travels to the Vatican and ultimately fails to save his friends life.

Tuesday, September 24

UNCANNY X-MEN #410
UNCANNY X-MEN #411
UNCANNY X-MEN #412
UNCANNY X-MEN #413
UX 410-413 occur during the course of a day, a year after XF 149 and a few weeks before UX 417.  Since this story ends with Archangel losing his blue skin color, it must occur after X 131, and the reference to calling Lorna would place it after X 132.  Warren also breaks his arm and leg in this story.  Xavier, Jean, and Logan are here, back from their travels  Xavier is in Canada, inviting Sammy Pare to the school, Jean is at home with Scott, and Logan is on a mission to Cassidy Keep.  Chamber has gone off to college, so this occurs between Chamber 1 and 4.  Its discovered that Havok is still alive.  Husk is now working and living at the school.  Annie arrives at Xaviers with Carter, presumably invited by Cyclops, and gets pulled into being a triage nurse for the wounded X-Men.  Green grass and trees in Vancouver and upstate New York.  Jackets in Vancouver and warm weather at Xaviers.

Friday, September 27

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #1 (14-23)
One day, perhaps a month after XXX 1 (8-13), during which time reporters have been gathering intel on the X-Men.  The executive producer of Spotlight is now working on a rough cut of the expose.  Conan and Manoli interview Bishop and Sage in Valle Soleada (outside Los Angeles), a meeting set up by Storm.

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #2 (1-18)
Probably the evening of  XXX 1 (14-23).  Conan and Wetherell are still in Valle Soleada, talking to the same cop they rescued in XXX 1.  By huge coincidence, they run into Gambit and Rogue in the same town as Bishop and Sage.  Gambit and Rogue have been on the road for weeks following XX 19.  It is about a week before XXX 2 (19-22).

Saturday, September 28

WOLVERINE v2 #179
One day.  Shaman summons Wolverine from Westchester (where we see green grass and trees) to Canada to battle a demon who has taken over Alpha Flights headquarters and possessed Sasquatch, Puck, and Snowbird.  Shaman mentions that Heather and Mac are occupied with the joyousness of Heathers pregnancy.  Logan defeats the demon and frees Alpha Flight.  Shaman tells Logan that the demon wanted his protege, Chuck Moss, who Shaman asks Logan to train.

Sunday, September 29

WOLVERINE v2  #180 (1-19)
The day after W2 179.  Logan trains Chuck Moss in British Columbia, where we see green grass and trees.  Full moon.

X-MEN UNLIMITED #42/1
One night with a full moon.  Krystal Van Heiden has captured Emma Frost to use her mutated DNA to create a diamond-like environment at her Crystal Palace in Antarctica.  Emma defeats her.

Monday, September 30

WOLVERINE v2 #180 (20-23)
The morning after W2 180 (1-19).  Chuck Moss passes his training and Logan gives him his totem, a worm, and calls him an Earthmover.  This segment must occur sometime before XU 45 (1-24).

Tuesday, October 1

UNCANNY X-MEN #414
One day, months after X 113.  Stacy X refers to UX 412 as having occurred the other day, but shes always practiced lazy language  clues in UX 415 tell us its been more than a week since UX 413.  Archangel is still in a cast.  Northstar accepts a teaching position at Xaviers, but is injured in an explosion that puts him in the infirmary.  If we wish to use XS 6-8 as the reason for Xaviers absence in UX 415, then we have to allow enough time between UX 414 and 415 for XS 6-8 to occur.  Green grass and trees in Ontario.

Wednesday, October 2

X-STATIX #6 (1-8)
One day.  Orphan has been missing for a while, since XS 5 (18-22).  Professor X helps Venus Dee Milo with her powers while the rest of the team appear on Lacunas show.  It is long enough before XS 6 (9-15) for profits at X-Statix cafes to be tallied as having declined two percent.

Friday, October 4

X-TREME X-MEN: X-POSE #2 (19-22)
One evening,about a week after XXX 2 (1-18).  Warren has white skin and no casts, so this segment must occur after UX 414.  It may occur shortly before Iceman discovers that Warren is out of his casts in UX 415.  Warren also sports cropped hair and a goatee, which he would had to have grown in the few days since UX 414.  The snow falling in Manhattan starts when Ororo confronts Warren, so it may be a subconscious manifestation of her mood.  Warren gives her a speech about the X-Men needing to portray a united front, with which Ororo disagrees.  Storm appears recovered here, but I theorize that she collapses right after this scene, and Logan realizes that they were kidding themselves into believing she was okay; he returns her to New Orleans for more rehabilitation.  The TV Guide on page 1 is for June, but a newspaper reads Friday, October something.

Saturday, October 5

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (20-21p2)
One day, months after XX 24 (18-19), which is true, technically.  They return to Paris, where it is presumably spring (this must be a topical reference) and we see green grass and trees.

X-STATIX #6 (9-15)
One day, long enough after the Lacuna Good Guy/Bad Guy broadcast in XS 6 (1-8) for it to be noted that takings at X-Statix cafes have declined two percent.  Spike Freeman notes that X-Statix will have to kill the missing Orphan. Meanwhile, Professor X deals with the theft of some costumes and then the thief, appearing as Bad Guy, trashes Lacunas studio.

UNCANNY X-MEN #415
One day, weeks after UX 413, although this reference is inconsistent with the one in UX 414 that UX 412 was the other day, given that UX 414 is referred to here as having occurred the other day.  It is a few days before UX 416.  Archangel is out of his casts, which surprises Iceman as its too soon for Warren to be healed.  Warrens goatee does not appear here; he may have shaved it since XXX 2 (19-22).  Northstar is in the infirmary.  Wolverine is not here, perhaps because hes tending to Storm in New Orleans. Green grass and trees at Westchester.  Full moon.

Sunday, October 6

X-STATIX #6 (16-22)
The day after XS 6 (9-15).  X-Statix battle Bad Guy.

X-STATIX #7 (1-8)
The same day as XS 6 (16-22).  Bad Guy retreats from the battle and Venus publicly discloses being a virgin.  Orphan comes to Professor X for a new suit.

X-TREME X-MEN #20 (1-15)
One day.  Bishop and Sage have returned from California to rejoin Storm and Logan in New Orleans, where Logan oversees her (resumed) rehabilitation.  Logan tells Storm that nature has its own pace (a lesson theyve both learned now)and remarks that shes doing better than expected, nowhere as good as she wants.  Storm also bemoans the fact that her rehab is taking so long; indeed, I have her injury in XX 18 as having occurred months earlier, in July.  Sage refers to the events of X 115 as having occurred recently.  She also references the mutants they met in XXX 1 (8-13), which may not have been very recent, given her comment, Remember California?  Bishop talks of rejoining Xaviers band of X-Men, and Ororo may not have shared with him her encounter with Archangel in XXX 2 (19-22).  Bishop and Sage then investigate some murders on a night with a full moon.

Monday, October 7

X-STATIX #7 (9-22)
The day after XS 7 (1-8).  Bad Guy injures Sharon Ginsberg then faces X-Statix.  Green grass and trees.

X-STATIX #8 (1-6)
The same day as XS 7 (9-22).  Bad Guy appears as Venus cousin Jamal and Professor X helps Venus and Orphan make sense of the creature.

X-TREME X-MEN #20 (16-22)
The day after XX 20 (1-15).  Bishop and Sage go to Xaviers, where they encounter Emma Frost and the mutant responsible for the murders.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

X-TREME X-MEN #21
The same day as XX 20 (16-22).  Bishop and Sage are teleported away from Xaviers while Emma Frost tries to deal with Garrett, who shes harboring while Professor X is away from the mansion, perhaps on his way back from his appearance in Los Angeles in XS 8 (1-6).  Storm tries to reason with Emma from New Orleans, where we see Logan starting to grow the goatee we see fully sprouted in UX 417 (8-22).  The weather at Xaviers is so cold that a lake on the grounds is iced over; this is inconsistent with the green grass and trees seen in XX 20 (16-22).

X-TREME X-MEN #22
The same night as XX 21.  Although a student at Xaviers refers to the events of XX 20 (16-22) as the other day, it must have actually been earlier this day.  Bishop and Sage storm the Xavier Institute, forcing Storm, despite her less-than-full recovery, to fly from New Orleans to New York, where she fights Emma.  We see snow on the ground at Xaviers, even before Storms arrival, and this is inconsistent with the green grass and trees seen not only in XX 20 but in this very issue.

X-TREME X-MEN #23 (1-16)
The same night as XX 22.  The X-Men battle Elias Bogan in the Danger Room.

Tuesday, October 8

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (21p3-21p4)
Probably the morning after XX 23 (1-16).  In Paris, Cannonball and Lila have breakfast and read an on-line news item about the events of XX 20-22.

X-TREME X-MEN #23 (17-22)
The morning after XX 23 (1-16).  The X-Treme team disagree with Xaviers philosophy and leave Professor X, White Queen, and Jean Grey at the Institute, where we see snow.

X-STATIX #8 (7-11)
Probably the day after XS 8 (1-6).  Orphan is back with X-Statix and Anarchist becomes team leader.

Wednesday, October 9

X-STATIX #8 (12-22)
The day after XS 8 (7-11).  X-Statix fight and defeat Bad Guy.  Solomon delivers a dying Sharon Ginsberg to X-Statix.  Venus takes Orphan to the dimension where she teleported her family.

UNCANNY X-MEN #416
One day, a few days after UX 415.  Sammy hasnt been assigned a room at Xaviers yet and Xavier still hasnt given him an orientation, presumably because everyones so busy, even though its been weeks since he came on board in UX 410.  Sammy hasnt made friends yet, but he and Juggernaut start to bond.  Given his awe of X-Men, Glob Hermans appearance here probably predates his joining the Omega Gang in X 135.  Stacy X is released from the infirmary while Northstar is still recuperating.  Lorna has been called about Alex and is expected to arrive at Xaviers in the morning (it is not known where she has been since hooking back up with the X-Men in X 132).  We see green grass and trees at Westchester.  It is cool enough for jackets and trench coats.

UNCANNY X-MEN #417 (1-7)
It must be the same night as UX 416.  As Warren sleeps, dreaming of Psylocke, Paige makes a discovery on the internet about one of Warrens businesses.

Thursday, October 10

UNCANNY X-MEN #417 (8-22)
The day after UX 417 (1-7).  It is a few weeks after UX 410-413.  The weather is nice enough for a game of catch.  Husk is dwelling on her past relationship with Chamber; this suggests that this issue must occur before Jonathons return to Xaviers at the end of Chamber #4.  Wolverine is with the group in New York (suggesting that he and Ororo have separated, at least temporarily ).  He has the goatee seen in XX 21, and he gets slashed up by Maximus Lobo.

UNCANNY X-MEN #418
The same day as the UX 417 (8-22).  Lorna arrives at Xaviers, so it must be the day after UX 416.  Archangel and Husk try to take on Maximus Lobo.  Green trees in Westchester County.

UNCANNY X-MEN #419
The same day as UX 418.  Archangel and Husk have a respite from Maximus Lobos attack while Havok awakens at Xaviers and Nightcrawler questions God.  Green grass and trees in New York.

UNCANNY X-MEN #420
The same day as UX 419.  Warren discovers that his blood has healing powers as the X-Men defeat Maximus Lobo and his werewolves.  Given Warrens discovery, this story must occur before XU 45 (24).  Green grass and trees in New York.

X-STATIX #9 (1-15)
Probably the day after XS 8 (12-22).  X-Statix finishes a mission in Africa, then watch the dailies of X-Statix: The Movie in California.  Sharon Ginsberg awakens in a hospital to find her wings removed and goes berserk.

Friday, October 11

X-STATIX #9 (16-22)
The day after XS 9 (1-15).  X-Statix defeat Sharon Ginsberg at the movie studio then report to the press on their African adventure.

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 (1-21p1)
Probably the day after UX 420.  Scott and Jean seem to be on friendly terms, so this segment should occur prior to Jeans trip to Hong Kong, first referenced in X 134 (3-22).  Juggernaut asks to stay with the X-Men.  Professor X fills Havok in on what he missed during his coma, then Polaris proposes to Havok and they plan to leave on an archaeological dig.  Nightcrawler decides to join them.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

Saturday, October 12

X-MEN UNLIMITED #44
One hot day, with green grass and trees in Westchester.  Given the relationship that has grown between Sammy and Juggernaut, this story likely occurs after UX 421 (1-21) and before Sammys departure in UX 422.  Jean is at Xaviers in this story, and she meets Sammy for the first time, so it cant be very long after UX 410.  Kurt appears here, but he doesnt appear to be in a position of leadership, which is consistent with his status between UX 421 (1-21) and UX 421 (21-22).  Logan is here without a goatee; apparently hes shaved the goatee he sported in XX 21 and UX 417-420.  Juggernaut learns a lesson as the X-Men deal with some local boys who torture animals.  There appears to be no school today, so it is likely a weekend day if this occurs during the school season (although there are apparently Sunday classes, as in X 135).

X-STATIX #10
One day, sometime before W/D 1.  While helping Orphan clean out Edie Sawyers room, Venus Dee Milo reads Edies diary.  It is months after Edies death in XFO 128.  As a note of irony, Ive placed this issue on what I posit would be Edies twenty-first birthday, a year after XS 10-FB (21) and two years after XS 10-FB (4).

Sunday, October 13

X-MEN UNLIMITED #45 (1-24p2)
One day.  A jealous co-worker nearly slays Guardian, and during the ensuing battle, Heather Hudson gives birth to a girl.  It is days before XU 45 (24).  Earthmover, who must appear here after W2 180 (21-23), wants to go to a Canadiens game, so it must be after the pre-season begins in late September.  Green grass and trees in Canada.

Wednesday, October 16

X-MEN UNLIMITED #45 (24p3-24p7)
One day, days after XU 45 (1-24).  Archangel has used his new healing power to save Guardian, so this segment must occur between UX 420 and UX 421 (23-24).  Jean and Logan (sans goatee) are here too.  The three X-Men may have been summoned the day of Macs near death in XU 45 (1-24) and have remained with Alpha Flight until Angels healing allowed Mac to regain consciousness in this segment.

Thursday, October 17

CHAMBER #4 (x-x)
Chamber returns to Xaviers from ESU.  This segment must occur after UX 421 (1-21), given that Paige was brooding about the absent Chamber in UX 417.  This segment must occur shortly before UX 422, Chambers next appearance at Xaviers, where its clear that he and Paige have not had much opportunity to clear the air.  Things at Xaviers appear to be calm, so this segment may well occur before X 134 (3-22).

[WOLVERINE v2 #181-186
Over the course of a few days, Logan (sans goatee) worms his way into and destroys a good chunk of the Jersey mobs.  He then faces the Punisher, who disagrees with Logans solutions.]

NEW X-MEN #134 (1-2)
One rainy night.  Mutant designer Jumbo Carnation dies in Alphabet City.  This event is noted as having occurred the other night in X 135 (1-14).

Friday, October 18

NEW X-MEN #134 (3-22)
The day after X 134 (1-2).  Logan is not at Xaviers; perhaps hes dealing with the Jersey mobs in W2 181-186.  Reference is made to Jean being in Hong Kong and expected home soon after being away for a while; however, it seems Jean may run into unexpected delays, as she doesnt make it back home until X 138 (16-23).  We see green grass and autumn leaves in Westchester and there is a reference that is made to it being late summer.

[WOLVERINE v2 #181-186
Over the course of a few days, Logan (sans goatee) worms his way into and destroys a good chunk of the Jersey mobs.  He then faces the Punisher, who disagrees with Logans solutions.]

Saturday, October 19

[WOLVERINE v2 #181-186
Over the course of a few days, Logan (sans goatee) worms his way into and destroys a good chunk of the Jersey mobs.  He then faces the Punisher, who disagrees with Logans solutions.]

Sunday, October 20

NEW X-MEN #135 (1-14)
A school day at Xaviers.  Xavier notes that he is opening the doors to the Institute to non-mutants in three days time.  Since X 138 labels Open Day a Wednesday, this then must be a Sunday; X 121 establishes that Xavier's doesnt hold to traditional human school practices, so there may very well be Sunday classes.  Quentin Quire has changed considerably in recent weeks.  Quire refers to the murder of Jumbo Carnation in X 134 (1-2) as having occurred the other night.  Glob Herman probably appears here after UX 416. We see green grass and trees in Westchester and its seasonable enough for Xorns Special Class (which is convening for the first time) to go camping.  Because of its special nature, Xorns class may not follow the traditional semester.  High on kick, Quentin Quire and his Omega Gang assault a group of mutant-hating youths.

Monday, October 21

NEW X-MEN #135 (15-22)
The day after X 135 (1-14).  Xavier discusses the Quire situation telepathically with his X-Men, including Jean, who is still in Hong Kong, and Logan, who isnt necessarily at Xaviers.  Xorn continues the camping trip with the Special Class.  Green grass and trees.

Tuesday, October 22

NEW X-MEN #136 (1-21)
The night of the day after X 135 (15-22).  The Omega Gang attacks a group of U-Men, and a squad of U-Men attacks the Special Class, who are still on the camping trip.  Beak and Angel have sex, apparently for the first time, given the dialog.  Xorn defeats the U-Men and the class is taken back to Xaviers school, where the Omega Gang capture Xavier.  It is before a Friday.  Green grass and trees.

Wednesday, October 23

NEW X-MEN #136 (22)
The morning after X 136 (1-21).  It is Open Day at Xaviers, the day that Xavier has invited non-mutants to tour the school for possible enrollment, perhaps for the semester following this.  The Omega Gang begin their attack on the school.  According to XX 24, this issue occurs after XX 23.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

NEW X-MEN #137
The same day as X 136 (22).  Wolverine is back at Xaviers, sporting a goatee once more.  The X-Men battle the Omega Gang.  In the end, Quentin Quire is defeated and Sophie of the Stepford Cuckoos is killed.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

NEW X-MEN #138 (1-6)
The same day as X 137.  The X-Men deal with the aftermath of the Omega Gangs riot on a Wednesday.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

Thursday, October 24

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (21p5-22p1)
Probably the day after X 138 (1-6).  Still in Paris, Cannonball and Lila learn of the riot at Xaviers via the internet.

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 (21p2-23p6)
One day.  Havok and Polaris leave with Nightcrawler for Bermuda.  Cyclops is among those who see them off, but Jean is not.  It is two days before UX 421 (23-24).  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

Saturday, October 26

UNCANNY X-MEN #422  FB
One day.  Stacy X makes a risque video for Warren before leaving Xaviers.

UNCANNY X-MEN #421 (23p7-24)
Probably the same night as UX 422-FB.  2 nights after UX 421 (21-23), Alpha Flight barges into Xaviers school to take the children.  Heather Hudson is no longer pregnant and James Hudson is healed, so this segment must occur after XU 45 (24)  and apparently the Hudsons gratefulness for Warren saving James has waned.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

UNCANNY X-MEN #422
The same night as UX 421 (23-24).  Nightcrawler, Havok, and Polaris discover an ancient mutant city on an archaeological dig and encounter the Church of Humanity.  Warren watches Stacys video.  Chamber appears here at Xaviers shortly after his return in Chamber #4.  Alpha Flight have come to retrieve the children at Xaviers school in the wake of the recent riot of X 135-137.  The X-Men battle Alpha Flight and only Squidboy ends up leaving Xaviers in the end.  A conversation between Juggernaut and Squidboy leads one to assume that Emma is alive, so this issue must occur before X 139 (21-22).  It is a few weeks before UX 423.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.  Full moon.

Tuesday, October 29

NEW X-MEN #138 (7-9)
It is a Tuesday, so it is likely six days after X 138 (1-6).  The remaining Stepford Cuckoos announce that they will depart Xaviers after the upcoming prize-giving ceremony and walk out on Emma Frost, who notes that she is twenty-seven.  This would make her a teenager at the time of her debut in UX 129.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

Thursday, October 31

NEW X-MEN #138 (10-14)
A Thursday.  Xorn helps Quentin Quire cast off his physical body and achieve another plane of existence.  Xavier notes that the school will be closing for the summer in exactly six days.  The break may be a week-long autumn break.  He also notes that after the break, he will step down as headmaster.  Green grass and trees in Westchester.

Friday, November 1

NEW X-MEN #138 (15)
The day after X 138 (10-14), a Friday.  Emma Frost goes clothes shopping with Angel.  According to X 140, this segment occurs a few days before X 139 (21-22).

Saturday, November 2

NEW X-MEN #138 (16-23)
The day after X 138 (15), a Saturday.  We see a prize-giving ceremony at Xaviers, where there are green grass and trees.  Angel informs Beak that shes pregnant with his child; this revelation so soon after their apparent first sexual encounter in X 136 (1-21) is an indication that Angels physiology is radically different from a normal humans.  That night, Jean Grey returns to Xaviers with Sooraya and finds Scott and Emma in a compromising situation.

NEW X-MEN #139 (1-20)
The same day as X 138 (16-23).  An angry Jean mucks around with Emmas mind and the X-Men grow concerned about Jeans Phoenix power.  Cyclops takes off.  The Stepford Cuckoos state that school is over for the summer, implying that, while the school itself is to close on the upcoming Wednesday, classes are already over.  We see green grass and trees at Xaviers.

Tuesday, November 5

NEW X-MEN #139 (21-22)
One night.  According to X 140, this segment occurs a few days after X 138 (15).  Beast finds Emmas diamond body smashed to pieces.  Given Emmas seeming death here, this segment must occur after UX 422.

Wednesday, November 6

NEW X-MEN #140 (1-14)
The day after X 139 (21-22).  It is sometime after XX 23 (17-22).  Summer vacation is cancelled until further notice, while Bishop and Sage are called in to investigate Emma Frosts murder.  Late this day, the Stepford Cuckoos note that school ought to have closed for summer by now, so it is likely that this is the day the school was scheduled to close, six days after X 138 (10-14).  Scott is still absent. Nightcrawler is back from the archaeological expedition.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

Thursday, November 7

NEW X-MEN #140 (15-22)
The day after X 140 (1-14).  Bishop and Sage continue their investigation, and Angels brood of larvae are discovered.

NEW X-MEN #141
The same day as X 140 (15-22).

Friday, November 8

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (22p2)

One day.  Cannonball learns that things with the X-Treme team are serious, though Im not sure what the exact reference is.

Monday, November 11

X-TREME X-MEN #24 (22p3-23)
One day.  Cannonball calls Storm to Paris, where we see green trees.  Storm wears the miniskirt we saw in XX 23.  He accepts her offer to join the X-Treme team.

Saturday, November 16

UNCANNY X-MEN #423
One day, a few weeks after UX 422.  Nightcrawler, Havok, and Polaris are all at Xaviers.  Scott has returned to Xaviers and things between him and Jean appear to be icy, so this segment must occur after X 141.  Logans goatee is gone and he has a new outfit, black with yellow tiger stripes.  The Church of Humanity leaves a calling card in front of Xaviers  a bunch of crucified mutants, including Jubilee, Magma, and Skin.  Archangels healing powers save the former two, but Angelo dies.  Xorn and Xavier cannot be reached; has Xavier left the school as he intended to do?  After Cyclops chews out Kurt for not briefing the team about the Church, they discover that someones been messing with Kurt through his presumed life as a priest.  That night, they find some unholy lab beneath St. Michaels Church.  Green grass and trees at Xaviers.

UNCANNY X-MEN #424
The same night as UX 423.

Tuesday, November 26

X-TREME X-MEN #25
One day.  It is probably a weekday during the college year.  In freeing Stryker from incarceration, Deathstrike makes it appear that Stryker was killed in an airplane explosion by the X-Men.  We see snow in the Rockies and green trees in Kentucky, where Cannonball has invited Storm, Bishop, Sage, and Wolverine (sans goatee), perhaps for Thanksgiving(?)  The X-Men investigate the site of the plane crash.  Kitty sees her school psychologist, and that night, she is abducted from the Belles of Hell by Deathstrike and Stryker.

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
Posted by Jeph! on May 20, 2003 at 16:31:39:
In Reply to: Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 18, 2003 at 21:51:39:

> I, in turn, have taken your material and reworked it into a slightly different order (but mostly the same)

Paul, I can't quite see the changes you made to my order -- I see that things you ADDED, but I can't seem to locate what you CHANGED.  The text is just so dense.  Any chance of you pointing out the specific changes you made to me, and mentioning why you made 'em?

There's got to be a better way to represent this stuff other than a list of text.  I find myself wondering about bar-graph-style timeline charts, with each bar's length corresponding to the storyline's elapsed time ... have you ever given thought to other methods of representing the data?

And is it just me, or is the main board page loading funny to anyone else?...

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 20, 2003 at 22:14:43:
In Reply to: Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
posted by Jeph! on May 20, 2003 at 16:31:39:

> > I, in turn, have taken your material and reworked it into a slightly different order (but mostly the same)

> Paul, I can't quite see the changes you made to my order -- I see that things you ADDED, but I can't seem to locate what you CHANGED.  The text is just so dense.  Any chance of you pointing out the specific changes you made to me, and mentioning why you made 'em?

Sorry 'bout that.  I can't think of everything offhand, but there wasn't much.  A nudge to W2 181-186 comes to mind...

> There's got to be a better way to represent this stuff other than a list of text.  I find myself wondering about bar-graph-style timeline charts, with each bar's length corresponding to the storyline's elapsed time ... have you ever given thought to other methods of representing the data?

Text is about my speed, I'm afraid  :(

> And is it just me, or is the main board page loading funny to anyone else?...

Yup.  Looks weird to me, too.  Not all posts show up on the main board page, but the numbers of replies are correct.  Then the formatting is off, too.

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
Posted by Administrator on May 21, 2003 at 20:13:54:
In Reply to: Re: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 20, 2003 at 22:14:43:

> > And is it just me, or is the main board page loading funny to anyone else?...

> Yup.  Looks weird to me, too.  Not all posts show up on the main board page, but the numbers of replies are correct.  Then the formatting is off, too.

The board will be down for maintenance on Memorial Day.

			*	*	*

Hulk/Wolverine: Six Hours...decisions, decisions...
Posted by Kevin  on May 21, 2003 at 14:22:18:
In Reply to: Jeph's recent X-Men chronology - second draft.
posted by Jeph! on May 14, 2003 at 03:39:40:

> NOT INCLUDED:

> HULK / WOLVERINE: SIX HOURS #1-4  this could go just about anywhere in Logan's chronology, and really depends on how it falls (earlier or later) into the Hulk's timeline.

> WOLVERINE / DOOP #1-2, WOLVERINE: SNIKT! #1-6  too early to tell.

> WOLVERINE: X-ISLE #1-5  didn't buy it.  Will comment once I get the TPB.

> X-STATIX #1-5, 9-10 - I just plain don't collect it, and can't comment.

Jeph, I'm going over Hulk chronology for Paul's calender, and I just got done reading the Hulk/Wolverine: 6 hours miniseries.  I don't know Wolvie's chronology really well, so I figured I'd go over this with you.  What we need is a recent space where Logan has had time to go on vacation in the Canadian woods.  Is it just me, or is that plane Banner takes off in at the start of the story in a town somewhere probably in the upper midwest?  Going by the fact that it was a small private plane, and the pilot knew the Canadian woods well, I just got the feeling that they were close to Canada, (if they were halfway across the company, a small plane like that would need to make a stop to refuel.  

Anyway, there's been two recent storyarcs in Hulk where this miniseries could be placed.  It could be placed after the current Abomination arc (set in the American Southwest) which ended in issue #54, but this seems to me too far from Canada for Banner to have a Canadian adventure.  But that's just conjecture on my part.

But after the storyarc from Hulk #45-49...wasn't Banner in Kansas/Nebraska during that arc? (I don't have those issues in front of me at this second).  That's at least closer to Canada, so maybe the ideal spot to stick this miniseries is inbetween Hulk issues 49 and 50.  Or perhaps we should wait and see where Banner is next issue.

But where this can fit into Wolvie's chronology, I'm not sure, so I figured I'd check with you: the Xmen Expert. ;-)

			*	*	*

Stupid spelling errors...
Posted by Kevin  on May 21, 2003 at 14:27:25:
In Reply to: Hulk/Wolverine: Six Hours...decisions, decisions...
posted by Kevin  on May 21, 2003 at 14:22:18:

> Jeph, I'm going over Hulk chronology for Paul's calender, and I just got done reading the Hulk/Wolverine: 6 hours miniseries.  I don't know Wolvie's chronology really well, so I figured I'd go over this with you.  What we need is a recent space where Logan has had time to go on vacation in the Canadian woods.  Is it just me, or is that plane Banner takes off in at the start of the story in a town somewhere probably in the upper midwest?  Going by the fact that it was a small private plane, and the pilot knew the Canadian woods well, I just got the feeling that they were close to Canada, (if they were halfway across the company, a small plane like that would need to make a stop to refuel. 

Stupid spelling errors...that should read: 'country', not 'company'.  As in I don't think Banner was on the other side of the country at the start of the miniseries.

What this message board really needs is a spelling correction device.  

And by the way, the message board looks messed up to me as well.  All of the responses aren't appearing on the main page.

			*	*	*

Re: Hulk/Wolverine: Six Hours...decisions, decisions...
Posted by Jeph! on May 21, 2003 at 16:28:02:
In Reply to: Hulk/Wolverine: Six Hours...decisions, decisions...
posted by Kevin  on May 21, 2003 at 14:22:18:

To be honest -- the Hulk/Wolverine: Six Hours series could prety much fit ANYWHERE in Wolverine's chronology.  Over the years we've seen that Logan's the type of guy who takes trips to Canada/Japan/Madripoor at the drop of a hat, as well as keeping a crappy apartment in Manhattan for the times he doesn't feel like staying at the X-Mansion.  The poor guy's been bouncing around from New Orleans to NYC these days too.

Really, the only relatively recent times we CAN'T insert HW:6H into Logan's chronology are between XX #19 and XU #39/2, and between XXX #2 p.19 and XX #23.

If you actually manage to place the Hulk issues on a CALENDAR, and overlap that with Paul's X-Men calendar, and you've placed the HW:6H series into a certain spot on the Hulk's timeline, the overlap will give you a good idea where to stick the series into Logan's timeline.  However, you may not be ABLE to place the Hulk issues...

So in situations like that I look at relative publication order:  HW:6H was published weekly in January 2003.  Given this, it fits best between W2 #185-186 (Jan and Feb, the end of the mob story arc and the "epilogue" with the Punisher) -- and seems to fit best after the Dominant Species arc and before the Riot.

On my version of the calendar, that's where you'll find W2 #181-186 (again based on relative publication) -- between Dominant Species and the Riot.  I say that HW:6H fits between #185 and 186, and for now that's where I'll place it -- but if your calendar work indicates a substantially different placing, let us know and I'll check if it's feasible.

-Jeph!

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Re: Hulk/Wolverine: Six Hours...decisions, decisions...
Posted by Kevin  on May 22, 2003 at 11:43:54:
In Reply to: Re: Hulk/Wolverine: Six Hours...decisions, decisions...
posted by Jeph! on May 21, 2003 at 16:28:02:

Okay, Jeph, I'll take that into consideration.  It'll be a couple more weeks till I'm ready to start posting my chronology findings on Hulk.  

Going by publication date for Hulk, since this miniseries was published in Jan., the ideal spot is to place it between Hulk issues 49 and 50.  

Going by the pacing of Bruce Jones' storyarcs in The Hulk, not much time passes inbetween each issue.  I was just concerned about the diference in how many times Wolverine appears a month (in multiple books), as opposed to the little amount that Hulk appears a month, (he's in only his own title, and this Hulk/Wolverine miniseries is the first out of his own book appearance he's made since The Order, I believe...).

			*	*	*

Is "Agent X" series cannon?
Posted by French Thom on May 15, 2003 at 15:33:10:

I would appreciate if someone could tell me before i buy it.

I also remember reading somewhere that the MAX series Fury is not cannon. I haven't read the series, so could anyone please tell me what are the problems with this one?

Thanks for the attention!

French Thom

			*	*	*

Yes.
Posted by Jeph! on May 15, 2003 at 16:47:30:
In Reply to: Is "Agent X" series cannon?
posted by French Thom on May 15, 2003 at 15:33:10:

> I would appreciate if someone could tell me before i buy it.

Yes, yes it is.  Buy it.

> I also remember reading somewhere that the MAX series Fury is not cannon.

That's right.  Basically, it takes place in an alternate future where an older Nick Fury is being put out to pasture by the new owners of SHIELD.

-Jeph!

			*	*	*
Re: Yes.
Posted by AndyH on May 16, 2003 at 01:32:51:
In Reply to: Yes.
posted by Jeph! on May 15, 2003 at 16:47:30:

  What about the Dazzler appearance in deadpool. She seemed much different than her previous apearance in Scott lobdell's final arc on X-men.

			*	*	*

Re: Yes.
Posted by Jeph! on May 16, 2003 at 11:30:09:
In Reply to: Re: Yes.
posted by AndyH on May 16, 2003 at 01:32:51:

>   What about the Dazzler appearance in deadpool. She seemed much different than her previous apearance in Scott lobdell's final arc on X-men.

So?

In her last appearance, Mojoworld had been attacked and decimated, and her husband was presumed dead.  She was stuck back on earth with nowhere to go and nothing to do -- so she tried to restart her singing career, hence the switch back to her original outfit.

When has Deadpool NOT been considered canon?

-Jeph!

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Wolfpack series; canonical?
Posted by John McDonagh on May 15, 2003 at 18:47:36:

www.marveldirectory.com/teams/wolfpack.htm
http://www.geocities.com/ratmmjess/wolfpack.html

Is Wolfpack canonical? Did they ever team up with any familiar faces? I know they had an OHOTMUDE Update '89 entry, which would indicate Earth-616 canonicity. Still, the real time element of the series might recommend it for the pre-modern era of Earth-616. 

I know Slag appeared in Marvel Comics Presents#11. 

			*	*	*

Re: Wolfpack series; canonical?
Posted by Paul O'Brien on May 16, 2003 at 10:58:04:
In Reply to: Wolfpack series; canonical?
posted by John McDonagh on May 15, 2003 at 18:47:36:

> Is Wolfpack canonical? 

Well, as you say, they're in THE OFFICIAL HANDBOOK OF THE MARVEL UNIVERSE UPDATE '89, so clearly they were intended as canon at the time.  And I can't think of anything which has subsequently disqualified them.

If they ever interacted with anyone, it would probably be somebody like Daredevil, I suppose.

			*	*	*

Error in "Impossible Man"
Posted by Jopili on May 16, 2003 at 10:44:38:

In:
IMPOSSIBLE MAN
X-Force / Cable Annual 1995 = there is "XF&C '95" instead of "XFOR&C '95"

			*	*	*

Chronology reviews for Daredevil #41-46, for Paul's calender
Posted by Kevin  on May 16, 2003 at 12:12:45:

Here's the latest reviews you've been waiting on Paul.  Anybody, if you see anything I missed, be sure and point it out. I'm not perfect.

DD #41
Lowlife Pt. 1 of 5
Written by Brian Michael Bendis<br>Drawn by Alex Maleev

Appearances:  DD, Stilt Man, Gladiator, Foggy Nelson, Owl, Milla (a new reaccuring love interest for Matt)

Synopsis, (With page breakdown): 

Pg. 1-6: DD saves a blind woman named Milla from being hit by a truck.<p>Pg. 7-11: Wilbur Day, (B-grade villian known as Stilt Man) meets Matt at his law office later that day.  He says hes leaving New York and crime behind.  He warns Matt that the Owl is taking over the Kingpins businesses.  He says that months ago, before Vanessa Fisk left town, she sold off all of Kingpins Empire to every lowlife in town, BUT NOT to the Owl.  The Owl has decided to take over anyway, and starts gathering old Kingpin workers under him, and makes a grab for power.  Gladiator escorts the somewhat mentally unhinged Stiltman from the building.

Pg. 12-13: DD is shown beating up lowlifes throughout Hells Kitchen, searching for the Owls hideout.

Pg.14-21: The Owl has a meeting with his hooligans.  One of his street dealers got mugged by DD, and reports his losses to the Owl.  The Owl kills that man.

Pg. 22:  Milla awakens in the middle of the night, DD still on her mind.

Additional References:  Jacket Weather outside, (Falls probably around the corner).  Gladiator is apparently one of Matts new bodyguards, (to replace the falling out Matts had with Luke Cage).  Small, crescant moon outside, in the scene with the Owl.

DD Issue 42
Lowlife pt. 2
Written by Brian Michael Bendis
Drawn by Alex Maleev.

Appearances:  DD, Milla, The Owl, Mr. Rosanthal, Jessica Jones, (from Alias), Kingpin

Synopsis, (with page breakdown):

Pg. 1-3:  Milla and her friend are on a rooftop.  The event where she was saved by DD is referenced as happening yesterday.  So it appears all of issue 41 happened in one day.  Milla decides she must meet DD again to thank him, and her friend tells Milla she remembers reading about him in the news, about him supposedly being a blind lawyer

Pg. 4-9:  DD interrupts a drug sale outside of a dance club.  He finds out from the Dealer where the Owl is staying, and rushes off to confront the Owl.  The Drug thats being sold is MGH: Mutant Growth Hormone.  Its apparently the latest rage on the streets, and the Owl is the one overseeing the production and sale of it.  

Pg. 10-16:  DD bursts in on the Owls place, roughs the Owl and company up a bit, but DD notices that theyre video recording him, and threatening to sue Matt Murdock.  DD says they have him confused with someone else.  Owls lawyer friend, (Mr. Anad, one of Kingpins former lawyers) has figured out that since DDs secret identity, (supposedly) is no longer a secret, they can just threaten legal action to get DD off their backs.

Pg. 17: Mr. Rosanthal meets with his lawyer at his mansion, (which we learn in the next 2 issues is in Conneticut)  The lawyer tries to convince Mr. Rosanthal to settle the lawsuit outside of court, saying its possible they could lose.  Mr. Rosanthal says to give him time to thank about it.<p>Pg. 18-20:  Matt, (along with bodyguard Jessica Jones):  enters his law office that afternoon, to find Milla there.  She touches his face and knows its DD, (though he denies it).

Pg.  21-23:  Cut to Rosanthal, who is murdered in his swimming pool, (his head is ripped off) by the Kingpin.

References:  Mr. Rosanthals lawyer states that the Judge over the Murdock vs. the Daily Globe case is about to set a start date for next week.  Its warm enough that Rosenthal swims in an outdoor pool.

DD Issue 43
Lowlife pt. 3
Written by Brian Michael Bendis
Drawn by Alex Maleev.

Appearances: DD, Milla, Foggy Nelson, Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, (from Alias)

Synopsis, (with page breakdown): 

Pg. 1-2: Mr. Rosenthals lawyer arrives back at Rosenthals mansion, to find the police swarming the place.  Apparently, the maid found Rosenthals body in the pool.  The lawyer comments that he was just here a little while ago when he last spoke to Rosenthal, (which I take to mean a few hours ago).

Pg. 3-12: Continuing from last issue, we see Milla meeting with Matt alone in his office, where she thanks him for saving her, and they hit it off.  She asks him out on a date, and he asks for time to think it over.  She leaves, and Foggy comes in and chews him out, saying another woman in his life is the last thing he needs right now.  The discussion turns to the Owl, and how hes spreading the MGH drug on the street.  Matt wants to take him out, but Foggy still urges secrecy.  He asks Matt to let someone else handle it.  Matt says Spiderman is out of town, and Luke Cage wont return his phone calls.  But Matt decides to speak to Luke in person.

Pg. 13-17: Matt goes to Lukes Apt., (later that day).  Luke says hes been avoiding Matt since the White Tiger trial, not because Hector died, but because hes fed up with the way Matts handling his whole situation: hes tired of Matt lying to everyone about not being DD.    He chews Matt out, calling him a coward.  Matt says he came by to ask Luke to handle this MGH drug problem, but Luke says that Matts a hero, he should handle it himself.

Pg. 18-19: Matts shown in costume over the next few panels beating up drug dealers on the street.  Hes stressing out over his lot in life.

Pg. 20: With a lot still on his mind, he shows up on that same evening out of costume at Millas address.  Milla can tell hes emotionally troubled, and lets him in.

Pg. 21:  Foggy, at this same time, is shown getting ready for an ACLU fund raiser being held downtown, when all of a sudden, the two cops from Rosenthals mansion appear at the doorstep to their law office, a search warrant in their hands.

References:  Matt says that Spiderman is out of town.  This might possibly be a good place to coincide this with the 2 Doc Ocks in Hollywood story from ASM, or when Spidey is in Africa in ASM #48, or when Spideys out of town in ASM #50.  Take your pick.  

DD Issue 44
Lowlife pt. 4
Written by Brian Michael Bendis
Drawn by Alex Maleev.

Appearances:  DD, Foggy, the two cops, (Det. Love and Det. Reznor), Milla, the Owl,  Mr. Anad, (the Owls lawyer buddy).

Synopsis, (with page breakdowns):

Pg. 1-4:  Milla and Matt are our walking the streets later that same evening, (continued from last issue) having a date of sorts.  Theyre talking about Hells Kitchen, and its violent past,  (its almost a description of that movie Gangs of New York).  Theyre having a good time, till they get close to Matts house and find the cops swarming it.

Pg. 5-10:  Matt talks to the cops swarming his house.  They believe hes a suspect in Rosenthals murder.  The cops inform him that Rosenthal was murdered this morning between 9 and 12 noon, at his home in Conn., (which is where these two detectives are from).  They decide to take Matt and Milla down to the police station for questioning. 

Pg. 11-18:  Matt is interrogated down at the precint.  The two out of town Detectives are sure theyre on the tip of a major case, and theyre sure Matt is DD, so they question him.  Milla says she was with Matt this morning in his law office, so he couldnt have murdered anyone, (which is true) but she doesnt let the cops know shes figured out Matts DD.  Foggy stops by, but Matt says he can handle the cops on his own.  As the interrogation heats up, one of the out of town cops gets angry and rips open Matts shirt, hoping to expose a costume beneath.  Hes bare-chested though.  The Chief of the Precint has seen enough, and frankly is scared of being sued by Matt, so she stops the interrogation and lets Matt and Foggy go.  Milla left separately.  The cops report that they found nothing in Matts house or office, though his home basement was clean, (a little too clean, thats what got their suspicion going).

Pg. 19-20:  Matt and Foggy leave the Police Precint, to find the Press swarming outside.

Pg. 21-22:  That same night, Mr. Anad confronts the Owl, holding up a newspaper talking about Rosanthals murder, and showing Matt being escorted by police, (it must be a late Extra edition).  Anad asks if the Owl was behind this.  Owl playfully likes to think he was, (but he wasnt).  He says something like:  Spread the word: were open for business.  The Owl thinks DD is out of the picture.

References:  The murder of Rosenthal is listed as happening between 9 and 12 that morning.  In the opening pages, as Matt and Milla walk the street, they were long sleeve coats and scarfs, (suggesting its cold) but considering Rosenthal was swimming outside that morning, it must be that time of year where its warm during the day, and cold at night.  Probably early Autumn.  

DD Issue 45
Lowlife pt. 5 of 5
Written by Brian Michael Bendis
Drawn by Alex Maleev.

Appearances:  Sammy Silke, Kingpin, DD, Foggy, Owl, and FBI Agent Driver, (note: hes one of the two FBI agents Sammy Silke turned himself into back in DD 30 or 31, but NOT the one who sold DDs identity to the press.  Where that guy is, I dont knowprobably on an extended vacation).

Synopsis, (with page breakdown):  

Pg. 1-4:  Narrative caption reads:  ALLENWOOD FEDERAL PRISON, MONTGOMERY, PENNSYLVANIA.  SECURITY LEVEL: MINIMUM/MALE.

Here we see what Sammy Silke, the Kingpin wannabe, has been up to:  rotting in prison.  Hes playing poker with some other inmates, and talking about how it all went wrong.  Hes figured out that the FBI Agent he revealed DDs identity to sold the info to the tabloids.  Then, Silke is informed he has a visitor.  He goes to what supposed to be a conference room, but once inside, the door slams shut behind him.  He turns, and sees sitting smugly in the corner: The Kingpin, (and Im unsure if hes still blind or not, but hes still heavily scarred from all the stab wounds Silke and his buddies gave him, but hes not wearing his Im blind glasses here.)

Kingpin sits there for a minute, and the panel focuses on the icy expression on his face.  He finally speaks:  Thank you for crying.  We know Sammy Silke is a deadman.

Pg. 5-8:  Narrative caption:  NEW YORK CITY, NEW YORKER HOTEL, ROOM 887.

Matt and Foggy are laying low, hiding from the press in this hotel.  Matt calls Milla up and leaves an apology on her answering machine.  Foggy then apologizes to Matt, saying everyones been giving Matt hell lately, and says Matt can now do whatever he wants to, Foggy wont coach him anymore, hell just offer support.  Matt suddenly realizes that with them having to lay low, the Owl will try to make his move that night.

Pg. 9-15:  The Owl is meeting with Anad and an illegal doctor who is manufacturing the MGH, (apparently using the Owls own mutant cells to make the drug).  The FBI burst in, and confront all of them.  They say they got a search warrant because a missing man was last seen here, (it was the Drug Dealer the Owl killed violently back in DD#41)  FBI Agent Driver casually lets slide to Mr. Anad that Sammy Silke was murdered in prison this morning, (to put the fear of God in them).  The Owl starts to escape, the stash of MGH in his hands, when suddenly

Pg. 16-20:  DD appears out in the street as the Owl flees the building.  They fight, and DD stomps his ass good.

Pg. 21:  DD hands the drugs the Owl was fleeing with over the Agent Driver, and leaves.  The Agent starts to warn him, (but DD leaves to fast).  The warning was going to be this:  That the word was out.  Kingpins apparently back in town.  

References:  Doctor Sykes, (the Owls drug making Doctor) says his last batch of MGH drugs that were in his freezer got ruined, thanks to some sort of battle Iron Man was having, which knocked out power in his part of the city.  (possibly a good place to put some sort of Iron Man issue?  Note: this incident didnt happen that night, but some previous recent night).  

Matt, (on his message left at Millas house), apologizes for the police interrogation, which he refers to as happening last night.  

Going by this, let me just construct a quick timeline of these last 5 issues:

Day 1:  Matt saves Milla from the truck.  That night, The Owl kills one of his men that got mugged by DD.

Day 2: Milla decides she wants to meet DD again.  That night, DD stops a drug deal outside of a Dance club. DD pays Owl a visit.

Day 3:  Milla meets Matt at his office.  Mr. Rosanthal is murdered that morning in Conneticut by the  Kingpin.  That night, Matt and Milla are hauled off down to the police station.

Day 4:  That morning, Sammy Silke in murdered in a Pennsylvania Prison by the Kingpin.  Matt calls Milla from a hotel to apologize.  He, (with the FBIs help) busts up the Owls crime ring that night.

Bonus review! (yeah, I sound like a salesman, dont I?  I usually wait till the end of a storyline to do reviews, but figured I would do this issue anyway.)  

DD Issue 46
Hardcore Pt. 1 of 5
Written by Brian Michael Bendis
Drawn by Alex Maleev.

Appearances:  Typhoid Mary, Kingpin, Milla, (and her girl friend), Mr. Dini, (Kingpins Consigliari, who we last saw around issue 30 helping Vanessa Fisk)  DD, Foggy, Jessica Jones, (from Alias)

Synopsis, (with Page breakdowns):

Pg. 1-6:  We open on the set of a Soap Opera film stage, where we find Typhoid Mary, (here, just plain old Mary) living a lovely life as a Soap Opera actor.  In case you dont know, Typhoid Mary is another of Matts old girlfriends and who is also another old Kingpin assasin.  Shes quite insane, suffering from multiple personality disorder, (somewhat ala Twoface).  In between scenes, shes told she has a reporter in her trailer.  She walks in, and the Kingpin is sitting in there. She doesnt recognize him, thinking hes a reporter wishing for a scope.  He starts to talk about multiple personality disorders, and how through hypnotism, those who suffer from it can gain a normal healthy life, (which Mary obviously has).  By this point, shes like Get out you freak.  He then goes on to say that its possible to break the hypnosis by inducing a shock upon the patient.  He slaps her violently.  A few seconds later, shes picking herself up off the floor, but its not the Mary we just sawjudging by the sadistic grin on her face.

Pg. 7-10:  Milla listens to the news on the radio, and hears about how last night DD broke up the Owls crime ring.  Shes amazed that Matt can go on a date, answer questions by the police, and turn around and go fight crime.  Flowers arrive with an apology from Matt. She decides to see him again.

Pg. 11-15:  Cut to a new scene, (which I recommend we place on the following night, not this days night, because it happens out of the country.  Well find out more perhaps next issue).

The Caption reads: SUCRE, CHUQUISACA, BOLIVIA.  We see a small shack out in the middle of nowhere, where inside, we see a man and a hooker in bed asleep.  The man in bed turns out to be Mr. Dini, who was last seen helping Vanessa Fisk sell off Kingpins empire.  The Kingpin sits down comfortably next to the bed and starts to discuss what hes been up to since he awoke from the coma he was in.  Kingpin pulls out a shotgun which Mr. Dini thought he had hidden, (apparently not well enough) and starts to load it.  Kingpin relates how he woke up alone in a hospital in the mountains of Jabal Katrina.  Wherever that is.  Nobody there spoke English.  By the time he found someone who did, he found all all that had happened.  His wife had left him there, and paid them a lot of money to watch over him.  He returned to America to find his wife gone, his son murdered, his empire divided up and sold off.  And his trump card:  DDs identity, was blown.  Hes been unable to locate his wife, but he finally tracked down Mr. Dini.

And then he says, (and I just gotta quote these next couple lines, cause theyre so perfect):

Kingpin:  ButTry as I mightI cant even imagine the series of events that led you to believe that helping my wife kill my own son and then broker the destruction of my empire was the RIGHT thing to do.

To which Dini replies:  Wellknowing as we both do that this is probably the last conversation we will ever havewhy dont YOU think about what kind of a man YOU are if your own son conspires to have you killedwhile the only woman you love would rather destroy your empire, steal all of your money, and leave you to bleed to death in some foreign countrythan be with you.  Lchaim, fat ass.

The next panel cuts to the outside of the shack, where we hear: BLAM, BLAM.

Pg. 16-21:  Cut to Matts office, where Foggy enters to read Matt the latest headline from the papers.  Fred Myers, (Boomerang) is suing Matt Murdock for a million dollars, for DD beating him up back in issue 28, (the nuff said issue).  They notice the lawyers representing him are a couple of ambulance chaser type lawyers, and they laugh about it, taking it as nothing serious to worry about.  Matt asks if the paper reports anything about how Boomerang was trying to assassinate Matt Murdock when DD beat him up.  Of course not.

Suddenly, Milla enters the room, and her and Matt have one of those ackward moments.  They agree to go to lunch that afternoon, and they walk out of the office, with Jessica Jones accompanying them as a bodyguard.  They dont get far down the street, when suddenly Typhoid Mary appears and attacks Matt, setting him on fire! (how she pulled that off, Ill wait till next issue to see)

References:  

Milla, after listening to the radio news in this issue, says something like, This is what he does? After he takes me out on a date, and we get hauled off to the police station?  After that, he goes and beats up the Owl?

That makes it sound like all those events happened on the same night.  But that doesnt match with Matt (right before heading out to beat up the Owl) calling up Milla from the hotel and apologizing for the events of, in his own words, last night.    Furthermore, Kingpins hoping around all over the place, so we have to give him time to do his events.  First hes killing Rosanthal, then he kills Sammy Silke, then he wakes up Typhoid Mary, then hes in Bolivia for petes sake!  And Im still not sure if hes still blind.  He wears his dark glasses in the scenes where he meets Mary, but doesnt in the scene in Bolivia.  I think the writer is setting us up for either a revelation where Kingpin says:  Look, Im not blind or Look, Im blind, but Ive come to terms with it, like you Matt!  Though how going into a coma cures blindness, Im not sure

So continuing my mini-calender from above, Id say this goes like: 

Day 4:  That morning, Sammy Silke in murdered in a Pennsylvania Prison by the Kingpin.  Matt calls Milla from a hotel to apologize.  He, (with the FBIs help) busts up the Owls crime ring that night.

Day 5:  Kingpin meets with Mary on the set of a soap opera, which Ill guess is on location in New York.  Milla listens to the radio about the DD/Owl fight.

Day 6:  Kingpin has had time to catch a plane to Bolivia, where he kills Mr. Dini.  Typhoid Mary attacks Matt and Milla outside his office.

Thats it. No more. Come back another day. 

			*	*	*

Jessica Jones in DD2 45 and ALIAS 21
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 17, 2003 at 17:16:50:
In Reply to: Chronology reviews for Daredevil #41-46, for Paul's calender
posted by Kevin  on May 16, 2003 at 12:12:45:

Thanks for the usual thorough job, Kevin.  I've added this information to the calendar.  When combined with Sean's contributions regarding ALIAS, I have Jessica Jones accompanying Matt and Milla in DD2 #45 MERE HOURS (lunch time)after she saves Mattie Franklin on page 17 of ALIAS #21 (early morning).  If this looks feasible, then things seem to work well, so far.

Paul

			*	*	*

You mean DD2 #46, right?
Posted by Kevin  on May 18, 2003 at 14:48:23:
In Reply to: Jessica Jones in DD2 45 and ALIAS 21
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 17, 2003 at 17:16:50:

You mean DD2 #46, right?  DD2 #45 revolves around Kingpin killing Sammy Silke and DD beating up the Owl.   I don't collect Alias, (not right now anyway, probably should though) so you'll have to double check with Sean.  

Also, if you're going to take into consideration that reference by Matt in DD2 #43 that Spiderman's out of town, well then, after reviewing the Calender you emailed me, the latest opportunity for Spidey being outta town would be around ASM 43-45, I believe, where Spidey's in Hollywood visiting Mary Jane.  

			*	*	*

Re: You mean DD2 #46, right?
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 18, 2003 at 21:57:59:
In Reply to: You mean DD2 #46, right?
posted by Kevin  on May 18, 2003 at 14:48:23:

> You mean DD2 #46, right?  

Sure do.  Sorry 'bout that.

> Also, if you're going to take into consideration that reference by Matt in DD2 #43 that Spiderman's out of town, well then, after reviewing the Calender you emailed me, the latest opportunity for Spidey being outta town would be around ASM 43-45, I believe, where Spidey's in Hollywood visiting Mary Jane.  

Well, that's a PUBLISHED out-of-town trip for Spidey, but there's nothing that says that Spidey can't be out of town for reasons not published.  My excuse was that Peter left town for the Labor Day holiday.

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: You mean DD2 #46, right?
Posted by Kevin  on May 19, 2003 at 11:07:47:
In Reply to: Re: You mean DD2 #46, right?
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 18, 2003 at 21:57:59:

> > Also, if you're going to take into consideration that reference by Matt in DD2 #43 that Spiderman's out of town, well then, after reviewing the Calender you emailed me, the latest opportunity for Spidey being outta town would be around ASM 43-45, I believe, where Spidey's in Hollywood visiting Mary Jane.  

> Well, that's a PUBLISHED out-of-town trip for Spidey, but there's nothing that says that Spidey can't be out of town for reasons not published.  My excuse was that Peter left town for the Labor Day holiday.

Well, yeah, that works too.   Now it's onward: gotta finish chronology on Hulk issues... 

			*	*	*

Re: Jessica Jones in DD2 45 and ALIAS 21
Posted by SKleefeld on May 20, 2003 at 12:08:57:
In Reply to: Jessica Jones in DD2 45 and ALIAS 21
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 17, 2003 at 17:16:50:

> Thanks for the usual thorough job, Kevin.  I've added this information to the calendar.  When combined with Sean's contributions regarding ALIAS, I have Jessica Jones accompanying Matt and Milla in DD2 #45 MERE HOURS (lunch time) after she saves Mattie Franklin on page 17 of ALIAS #21 (early morning).  If this looks feasible, then things seem to work well, so far.

I don't have my books handy but that sounds about right. I've found a number of instances in Alias where Jessica works for 30-40 hours straight. I kept going through them, looking for breaks where she could at least sleep, but some of the stories simply don't allow for it.

I'm starting to think one of her super powers is simply to not need sleep! (Actually kind of useful for a P.I.)

-- Sean

			*	*	*

looking for recent sightings of:
Posted by J.E. Mills on May 17, 2003 at 02:18:57:

Can anyone tell me if anyone of the following international characters have made an appearance in the last year or so:

Le Peregrine
Shamrock
Sabra
Arabian Knight
Sunfire
Captain Britain
Vormund

i am doing some research and might have missed some recent sightings. 

Thank you.

			*	*	*

Re: looking for recent sightings of:
Posted by Paul O'Brien on May 17, 2003 at 06:24:43:
In Reply to: looking for recent sightings of:
posted by J.E. Mills on May 17, 2003 at 02:18:57:

Sabra was last seen in NEW X-MEN #132.  Sunfire was last seen in X-MEN UNLIMITED #39.

The Arabian Knight was killed by Humus Sapien in THUNDERBOLTS #55, back in 2001.

I think the remaining characters are simply in limbo.

			*	*	*

Re: looking for recent sightings of:
Posted by Cook on May 17, 2003 at 07:40:53:
In Reply to: looking for recent sightings of:
posted by J.E. Mills on May 17, 2003 at 02:18:57:

I believe the last appearance for Captain Britain was in X-Treme X-Men #3, when he came to retrieve Betsy's body...

The last time I remember seeing Shamrock was in Guardians of the Galaxy (she appeared with Irish Wolfhound)...

			*	*	*

Re: looking for recent sightings of:
Posted by Jeph! on May 17, 2003 at 12:21:38:
In Reply to: looking for recent sightings of:
posted by J.E. Mills on May 17, 2003 at 02:18:57:

In addition to what others have said, Le Peregrine recently appeared in Avengers v3 #46 ... but seeing as that's already up on the MCP, you may already have known about it.

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

NIGHTCRAWLER...NIGHTHAWK II...NINGAL
Posted by Arthur Stein on May 17, 2003 at 11:48:06:

new entries marked **

NIGHTCRAWLER/KURT WAGNER
UX 201
**AF 33
**HOPE 1
**SWII 7
UX 202

NIGHTHAWK II/KYLE RICHMOND
DEF 114
**DEF 119
NHAWK 1

NINGAL
CHAMBER OF CHILLS 4
**DRSTR2 35
DRSTR2 36
DRSTR2 37

Note to newcomers. Just to explain what my postings areas an avid Marvelist I had my own version of this Marvel Chronology Project (MCP). I am now comparing the two, and for all character entries in the MCP, I am checking if I have any appearances that may have been overlooked. Validating them. Chronologizing them. Posting them (so others have an opportunity to refute or comment). The aim... to help in the completeness of this magnificent piece of information engineering! 

#88

			*	*	*

Penance II and III
Posted by Jeph! on May 17, 2003 at 12:31:57:

While I was checking the question about Le Peregrine (and it took me a while to realize he wouldn't be under "L", foolish me), I noticed a mistake in the Penance listings.

Penance III appeared in Gen-X #68-69 (which took place in-between Gen-X #62 and 63, thanks to the six-month gap).  However, you have those appearances credited to Penance II.

Penance II ceased to exist in Gen-X #57, when the two St. Croix girls inhabiting that body managed to escape -- the body then took on a life of its own, becoming Penance III.  All post-#57 appearances of the Penance form, including the ones I pointed out above, are Penance III.

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Additionally... St. Croix sisters overhaul.
Posted by Jeph! on May 17, 2003 at 13:11:02:
In Reply to: Penance II and III
posted by Jeph! on May 17, 2003 at 12:31:57:

Checking your listings for the St. Croix girls themselves...

Background: Nicole and Claudette St. Croix have the ability to merge with each other and other family members.  They have merged with each other to form "M" (a copy of their older sister, M II); they have merged with each other to form Penance II, and they have merged with each other and their brother Emplate to form "M-Plate".

When we first meet the girls, they are in their merged form of "M".  They stay this way until Gen-X #31, when they are separated by an explosion.  Now, you give both girls BTS listings for the time they spent as M -- but you list their first individual appearances incorrectly as Gen-X #36.  This is wrong; they appeared as separate girls only from #31 to #34 (and #39-40).

Also, your listing for M should match up identically to the BTS listings for the girls -- but it doesn't.  Several issues in M's chronology are missing from the girls' -- everything from GenX #14-29, plus annual 1996.  Issue #30 is missing from everyone's chronology, but I believe that's caused by the second gap.

In #34, the girls merge with Emplate to form M-Plate.  All three remain merged until #39.  Following your previous pattern, you should have a separate listing for M-Plate covering #34-39, and BTS listings for Nicole, Claudette, and Emplate for that time.  However, you don't.  You continue the mistake of starting the merge in Gen-X #36, and while you give Emplate BTS entries, the girls are listed as full-fledged appearances.  Those should be corrected to BTS.

In Gen-X #31-35, you have appearances for M.  Now, since M is ONLY the combined form of Claudette and Nicole, whenever they're not merged, M doesn't exist -- and shouldn't appear.  The only times after #31 that the girls merge to form M are in #34 and #40.

Now, in Gen-X #40, the girls become Penance II.  Following your old pattern from when they were "M", both girls should have BTS listings for all of Penance II's appearances from Gen-X #40-57.  But they don't.

Now, the argument could go either way -- either both girls are BTS inside what is, essentially, a third entity; or both girls simply ARE the entity, in which case they wouldn't get BTS entries, but there should be a "see M-Plate" / "see Penance II" notation link in the appropriate spots.

The way M-Plate talks in #34-39 indicates that the merged entities ARE in fact separate, with the girls unable to control them -- this indicates that we should go with BTS'es rather than name-change-style notation links.  But, whatever we decide, it should be consistent.

Going with BTS entries, this is what that section of the entries for Emplate, M, M-Plate, and both St. Croix girls should look like (my changes starred):

EMPLATE / MARIUS ST. CROIX
...
GENX 34
*GENX 35-BTS
*GENX 36-BTS
GENX 37-BTS
GENX 38-BTS
GENX 39
...

M
Caution: See also Claudette St. Croix and Nicole St. Croix
...
GENX 29
GENX 31
(*Gen-X 32, 33, and 35 removed)
GENX 34 (the girls merge briefly before merging with Emplate)
*GENX 40 (the girls merge briefly before switching bodies with Penance I)

M-PLATE
* Caution: see also Emplate, Nicole St. Croix, and Claudette St. Croix
*font color=Red GENX 34
*GENX 35
GENX 36
GENX 37
GENX 38
GENX 39

ST. CROIX, CLAUDETTE and NICOLE (both entries are identical)
...
GENX 13-BTS
*GENX 14-BTS
*GENX 15-BTS
*GENX 16-BTS
*GENX 17-BTS
*GENX 19-BTS
*GENX 20-BTS
*GENX 21-BTS
*GENX 23-BTS
*GENX '96-BTS
H@ '97/2-BTS
GENX '97-BTS
*GENX 24-BTS
*GENX 25-BTS
*GENX 29-BTS
*font color=red GENX 31
*GENX 32
*GENX 33
*GENX 34
GENX 35-BTS
*GENX 36-BTS
*GENX 37-BTS
*GENX 38-BTS
GENX 39
GENX 40
*GENX 41-BTS
*XU 20-BTS
*GENX 43-BTS
*GENX 45-BTS
*GENX 46-BTS
*GENX 47-BTS
*GENX 51-BTS
*GENX 53-BTS
GENX 57
GENX 58
GENX '99

If I've overlooked anything, please let me know.  Thanks!

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Whoops - one final thing.
Posted by Jeph! on May 17, 2003 at 13:17:58:
In Reply to: Additionally... St. Croix sisters overhaul.
posted by Jeph! on May 17, 2003 at 13:11:02:

Penance DOES appear in Gen-X #40, for two panels -- she merges with M, and the two split into M II and Penance II.  (Additionally, her full name should be listed, as it is for M II.  They're the same person.)

So, updated listings for the Penances (as before, not including any books that aren't already on the MCP):

PENANCE / *MONET YVETTE CLARISSE MARIA THERESE ST. CROIX
...
GENX 39
*GENX 40

PENANCE II
Caution: See also Claudette St. Croix and Nicole St. Croix
GENX 40
GENX 41
XU 20
GENX 43
GENX 45
GENX 46
GENX 47
GENX 51
GENX 53
GENX 57
*(GenX #68-69 removed)

PENANCE III
GENX 57
GENX 58
GENX '99
GENX 60
GENX 61
*GENX 68
*GENX 69
UX 379

Phew!  That oughtta do it!

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Earth/Universe/Paradise X chronology...
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 17, 2003 at 15:41:19:

I have the general reading figured out for most issues in Earth X series. There are few I can't place, though (see the end of this note).

History X (forthcoming series)
Earth X 0
Earth X 1
Earth X 2
Earth X 3
Earth X 4
Earth X 5
Earth X 6
Earth X 7
Earth X 8
Earth X 9
Earth X 10
Earth X 11
Earth X 12
Earth X X
Universe X 0
Universe X - Fantastic Four Special
Universe X 1
Universe X 2
Universe X 3
Universe X - Spidey Special
Universe X 4
Universe X - Cap Special
Universe X 5
Universe X 6
Universe X 7
Universe X 8
Universe X - Beasts Special
Universe X 9
Universe X 10
Universe X 11
Universe X - Iron Men Special
Universe X 12
Universe X X
Paradise X - Heralds 1
Paradise X - Heralds 2
Paradise X - Heralds 3
Paradise X 0
Paradise X 1
Paradise X 2
Paradise X Xen Special
Paradise X 3
Paradise X 4
Paradise X 5
Paradise X Devils Special
Paradise X 6
Paradise X 7
Paradise X 8
Paradise X 9
Paradise X 10
Paradise X 11
Paradise X 12

There are 3 issues I can't place...
Earth X One-Half
Paradise X - Ragnarok 1
Paradise X - Ragnarok 2 

Any suggestions?

Thanks! 

			*	*	*

Re: Earth/Universe/Paradise X chronology...
Posted by StAkAr Karnak on May 17, 2003 at 22:00:37:
In Reply to: Earth/Universe/Paradise X chronology...
posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 17, 2003 at 15:41:19:

> There are 3 issues I can't place...
> Earth X One-Half
> Paradise X - Ragnarok 1
> Paradise X - Ragnarok 2

They are dated like so:
Paradise X 8 - Feb 03
Ragnarok 1 - Mar 03
Ragnarok 2 - Apr 03
Paradise X 9 - May 03

Additionally, in PARAX 8, Loki & Thor talk about going to Asgard, and they do so in RAGNAROK.

On a quick flip-through of Earth X One-Half, Nick Fury discusses the fall of S.H.I.E.L.D. and related events (Flashbacks).  The Skull is still alive and in power, so it takes place some time during Earth X.  Regretfully, I don't have the time right now to figure out exactly when.

- StAkAr Karnak

			*	*	*

Re: Earth/Universe/Paradise X chronology...
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 17, 2003 at 22:16:06:
In Reply to: Earth/Universe/Paradise X chronology...
posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 17, 2003 at 15:41:19:

> I have the general reading figured out for most issues in Earth X series. There are few I can't place, though (see the end of this note).

Following Earth X #X, there is an epilogue in the hardcover collection.  Cap lights the Human Torch in New York City.  This is the same scene that ends Earth X #X from a differnet perspective and without dialogue.  Afterward, Reed Richards and the Royal Family of the Inhumans teleport back to Latervia.  Making appearances are Alicia Grimm, Namor, Redwing 2 (Wyatt Wingfoot), Cap, Peter Parker, Luke Cage, Venom 2 (May Parker), Texas Jack, Ben Grimm, Bruce Banner and the Hulk, Mr. S. (Scott Summers), Dogface, John Jameson and his wife Kristine and their child Jay, Reed Richards, X-51, Medusa, Triton, Karnak, Gorgon, one of the Daredevils, Iron Madien, Luna, and some Doombot Sentinels.  I think I can identify the current Black Knight (Ahura, son of Black Bolt and Medusa), and if so, a person who can only be King Britian.  There's also a cast of thousands in the background, but I can't identify anymore of them.  I suppose since the Silver Surfer is inside the New York torch, he appears behind the scenes.

The Earth X 0.5 issue is set before Earth X #O.  I believe the "present" leads into Earth X #1.

Paradise X: Ragnarok was released between Paradise X #8 (December 2002) and #9 (March 2003).  Any reason the issues can't be placed there?

After writing all of this, I stumbled upon the Earth X Unofficial Timeline ( http://members.aol.com/adamefrey/timeline.html ).  Not only does it show when everything fits together, it has some annotations.

			*	*	*

Re: Earth/Universe/Paradise X chronology...
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 17, 2003 at 22:27:09:
In Reply to: Re: Earth/Universe/Paradise X chronology...
posted by Andy Holcombe on May 17, 2003 at 22:16:06:

> > I have the general reading figured out for most issues in Earth X series. There are few I can't place, though (see the end of this note).

> The Earth X 0.5 issue is set before Earth X #O.  I believe the "present" leads into Earth X #1.

After I worte my message, I did a little more looking around on that timeline ( http://members.aol.com/adamefrey/timeline.html ), and according to it, Earth X #0.5 takes place at various times between Earth X #3 and #8.

			*	*	*

Updated chrono for Earth X, etc...
Posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 18, 2003 at 10:18:42:

In Reply to: Earth/Universe/Paradise X chronology... posted by Jimmy Flowers on May 17, 2003 at 15:41:19:

Thanks for your help guys. Here's an updated version.

History X (forthcoming series)
Earth X 0
Earth X 1
Earth X 2
Earth X 3
Earth X 4
Earth X 5
Earth X 6
Earth X 7
Earth X 8
Earth X 9
Earth X 10
Earth X 11
Earth X 12
Earth X X
Universe X 0
Universe X - Fantastic Four Special
Universe X 1
Universe X 2
Universe X 3
Universe X - Spidey Special
Universe X 4
Universe X - Cap Special
Universe X 5
Universe X 6
Universe X 7
Universe X 8
Universe X - Beasts Special
Universe X 9
Universe X 10
Universe X 11
Universe X - Iron Men Special
Universe X 12
Universe X X
Paradise X - Heralds 1
Paradise X - Heralds 2
Paradise X - Heralds 3
Paradise X 0
Paradise X 1
Paradise X 2
Paradise X Xen Special
Paradise X 3
Paradise X 4
Paradise X 5
Paradise X Devils Special
Paradise X 6
Paradise X 7
Paradise X 8
Paradise X - Ragnarok 1
Paradise X - Ragnarok 2
Paradise X 9
Paradise X 10
Paradise X 11
Paradise X 12
Paradise X A

Earth X One Half occurs between Earth X 3 and 8. (Anyone able to pin it down?)

			*	*	*

Human Torch #1 revisited
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 17, 2003 at 18:52:51:

Now that Human Torch #2 has come out and the flashback to Johnnys high school years from issue #1 appears to be over, Id like to recap where the various segments of that flashback would fall in Johnny Storms chronology.  Two points:

1) The flashback does occur at the end of Johnnys sophomore year of high school and the fall of his junior year, BUT Johnny does NOT become the Torch during the summer between; he was ALREADY the Human Torch by his sophomore year.

2) Johnnys reference to being invited to a party at Avengers Mansion on October 31 of his junior year is an ERROR.  Established chronologies place the formation of the Avengers at the end of the summer vacation between Johnnys junior and senior years of high school.  Unfortunately, we have to pretend Johnny didnt say that.  (Good work, Karl Kesel.)

So heres my proposed calendar of Johnny appearances.  Quotations are from George Olshevsky's calendar placements and chronology as laid out in Official Marvel Index to the Fantastic Four #1-2.  Also note a proposed change in MCP chronology for A 1.5.

SPRING OF JOHNNY'S SOPHOMORE YEAR

ST 101  late April ("This story occurs in the spring, because Johnny Storm is still in school, and he and his classmates are anxiously awaiting the opening of an amusement park near Glenville.")

ST 102  early May ("One or two weeks later...the Human Torch encounters the Wizard.")
FF 8  May<br>ST 103  May ("Shortly after" FF 8.  "Because Johnny is still in school for several more weeks at that story's conclusion, it must occur before the story in" FF 9.)
HT 1 (pg. 1-7)  mid June (Contrary to what were led to believe, Johnny is already the Human Torch here, but hes keeping this a secret)

SUMMER BETWEEN JOHNNY'S SOPHOMORE AND JUNIOR YEARS

FF 9  late June through July ( "Because Johnny Storm has the time to hitchhike across the country to Hollywood with his teammates and then spend several weeks in various locations filming a motion picture, this story can only take place during one of his summer vacations.... This particular summer vacation must be the one between Johnny's sophomore and junior years in high school.")
ASM 1/2 ~ FF@ 1/2  August
ST 104  August ("sometime after" ASM 1/2)
FF 10  August
ST 108-FB -- August ("Johnny Storm encounters counterfeiter Wilhelm Van Vile...shortly after" FF 10)

FALL OF JOHNNY'S JUNIOR YEAR
ST 105  early September ("Soon after" ST 108-FB.  This is the last issue in which Johnny treats his ID as a secret.)
HT 1 (pg. 8-15)  early September (Johnny reveals his ID to his class)
FF 11 -- September ("By this time, everyone knows that Johnny Storm is the Human Torch...")
ST 106  September ("A few days after" FF 11)
FF 11/2  September
ST 107  late September ("Approximately a month after" FF 11/2)
FF 12  late September (This is the story the Thing notes as being "a coupla months" before A 1.5, but it must actually be thirteen to fourteen months before.)
ST 108  early October (Shortly after" FF 12)
HT 1 (pg. 16, pn. 1)  October 10th
HT 1 (pg. 16, pn. 2)  October 19th
HT 1 (pg. 16, pn. 3-4)  October 21st
HT 1 (pg. 16, pn. 5)  October 22nd
HT 1 (pg. 17, pn. 1)  October 29th  Johnnys reference to Avengers Mansion here cannot be canon, as the Avengers do not form for another ten months; see below.
HT 1 (pg. 17, pn. 2)  October 31st 
HT 1 (pg. 17, pn. 3)  November 2nd
HT 1 (pg. 17, pn. 4-pg. 18)  November 5th
HT 1 (pg. 19-22)  November 7th
FF 13  late December ("The only time that Johnny Storm had time off from school for the Fantastic Four's trip to the moon...is during one of his vacations as a high-school junior, almost certainly his Christmas vacation.")
FF 14  late December

WINTER/SPRING OF JOHNNY'S JUNIOR YEAR

ST 109  January (About a month after FF 14)
ASM 3  February (In the middle of winter)
ST 110  late February (Sometime after ASM 3)
FF 15  March
ST 111  March (Shortly after FF 15.  It is late winter)
FF 16  April (Because the Thing helps Alicia Masters with her spring cleaning but Johnny Storm and his friends are still wearing jackets at their picnic, it can be inferred that this story takes place in April.)
FF 17  April (continued from FF 16)
FF 18  April (A day or two after FF 17)
ASM 5  late April (A week or two after FF 18)
ST 112  early May (Shortly after ASM 5)

SUMMER BETWEEN JOHNNY'S JUNIOR AND SENIOR YEARS

ST@ 2  July (Johnnys summer vacation is well under way in this story)
FF@ 1  August (Because the Fantastic Four take an ocean cruise in that story, it must take place sometime during Johnny Storms summer vacation, the only time that Johnny would be able to go on such a voyage.)
A 1  late August (The active assistance of the Teen Brigade in that story indicates it is still summer.  Since the Avengers do not form until now, theres no way that Johnny could be invited to a party at Avengers Mansion in October of his junior year of high school, in HT 1 above.)

FALL OF JOHNNY'S SENIOR YEAR

ST 113  late October (Johnny has been back at school for a while and has a steady girlfriend, Doris Evans.  This rules out the placement of HT 1 in the fall of Johnnys senior, instead of junior, year.  In HT 1, the fall of his junior year, Johnny was chasing a girl named Hannah.)
FF 19 ~ DRSTR2 53 ~ WCA2 22 ~ ROA 3 & ROA 4  NovemberST 114  November (Shortly after FF 19)
A 1.5  November.  Some references in this continuity implant are incorrect: it is not just a week after A 1, it is not just a coupla months after FF 12, and it is not barely a year since FF 1.  It is announced here that the Avengers will be housed in Tony Starks Manhattan abode, which becomes Avengers Mansion, the place that Johnny actually could not have referenced back in HT 1.  (Russ, please note the placement of A 1.5 after ST 114 instead of before FF 19; this is because A 1.5 must occur after TTA 49 because of Giant-Mans presence, and TTA 49 occurs after ST 114 according to the Continuity Corner of Marvel Saga #11.)
FF 20  November
ST 115  November (A day or two after FF 20)
etc.

How does this look, folks?

Paul

			*	*	*

Captain America v4 #12-13
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 17, 2003 at 18:59:40:

Okay, I'm still not buying the revision of Cap's time on ice in CA4 12-13.  And I'm really irked that Cap seems to be buying it so easily.  This whole thing looks incredibly suspicious to me, and I wonder why Cap finds it so believable.  If it really is true, then we're dealing with a retcon of established canon events, and I'm hoping Chuck Austen doesn't have that in mind.  But Austen is making Cap look like a total weenie; I can only hope his behavior is a side effect of Inali Redpath's drugs.

In any case...should we consider the Avengers' scenes in CA4 13 to be canon appearances?  These scenes don't appear to be part of the suspicious film that Cap is watching, but I can't tell for sure.

--Paul 

			*	*	*

Re: Captain America v4 #12-13
Posted by Ron Flick on May 24, 2003 at 06:50:16:
In Reply to: Captain America v4 #12-13
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 17, 2003 at 18:59:40:

> In any case...should we consider the Avengers' scenes in CA4 13 to be canon appearances?  These scenes don't appear to be part of the suspicious film that Cap is watching, but I can't tell for sure.

The scene appears to be a flashback from Steve's "memory", so I would consider it canon.  Concerning your other comments about the current story arc, I sure hope it doesn't change Cap's history too drastically.  But considering everything already revealed in  TRUTH, as well as the  EXTREMISTS/ ICE arc, I am beginning to wonder.

			*	*	*

Cap and the "Truth"
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 24, 2003 at 21:42:33:
In Reply to: Re: Captain America v4 #12-13
posted by Ron Flick on May 24, 2003 at 06:50:16:

> The scene appears to be a flashback from Steve's "memory", so I would consider it canon. 

Steve wouldn't remember those panels showing the Avengers because he was outside the sub at the time.  He wouldn't know what the Avengers were saying and doing in the moments before Giant-Man fished him out of the drink.

But I am willing to consider these scenes as genuine, not part of a suspect video, unless others can think of a reason not to consider them canon.  I think I'll wait to see what happens in CA4 14, then submit an addendum to the Avengers' chronologies to account for those panels.

> Concerning your other comments about the current story arc, I sure hope it doesn't change Cap's history too drastically.  But considering everything already revealed in  TRUTH, as well as the  EXTREMISTS/ ICE arc, I am beginning to wonder.

But was TRUTH the truth?  I hear the new War Machine series will pick up on plot threads in TRUTH, but what's the conventional wisdom on its canonicity?

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Cap and the "Truth"
Posted by Paul O'Brien on May 26, 2003 at 07:56:12:
In Reply to: Cap and the "Truth"
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 24, 2003 at 21:42:33:

> But was TRUTH the truth?  I hear the new War Machine series will pick up on plot threads in TRUTH, but what's the conventional wisdom on its canonicity?

From what I recall, TRUTH #5 (the penultimate issue) ends by cutting to Captain America, in the present day, having the story told to him by a relative of one of the characters in the series.  That apparently establishes the entire previous series as a flashback and allows us to invoke the "unreliable narrator" get-out to explain away any impossibilities.

CREW is supposedly going to feature a character who is the descendent of one of the characters from TRUTH.  It does at least seem to establish that TRUTH is intended as canon, at least to some extent.

			*	*	*

Re: Cap and the "Truth"
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 27, 2003 at 07:28:52:
In Reply to: Re: Cap and the "Truth"
posted by Paul O'Brien on May 26, 2003 at 07:56:12:

> From what I recall, TRUTH #5 (the penultimate issue) ends by cutting to Captain America, in the present day, having the story told to him by a relative of one of the characters in the series.  That apparently establishes the entire previous series as a flashback and allows us to invoke the "unreliable narrator" get-out to explain away any impossibilities.

Paul, any idea when this falls into Cap's recent chronology?

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Cap and the "Truth"
Posted by ShadZ on May 27, 2003 at 10:20:23:
In Reply to: Re: Cap and the "Truth"
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 27, 2003 at 07:28:52:

> Paul, any idea when this falls into Cap's recent chronology?

It is just one panel, with no clues. TRUTH #6 will be needed...

ShadZ

			*	*	*

Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
Posted by captamr on May 18, 2003 at 12:52:04:

Starfox participates in the battle with the Beyonder in SWII 5. This battle involves Avengers, Fantastic Four, and X-Men and easily follows all of the characters continuity except for Starfox. The events in SWII 5 follow the return to Earth of most of these characters in an Avengers-Fantastic Four multi-part story battle with the Skrulls hyper-wave bomb culminating with a large 1985 Annual crossover between Avengers and Fantastic Four. A 261 has Starfox leaving with Firelord on another quest throughout the galaxy as the Avengers return to Earth and their encounter with the Beyonder.

Starfox cant be their and his appearance is just a mistake as supported by the chronologies of numerous other characters.

Starfox has not been listed in SWII 5 so has someone already made this judgement? Do we have a policy that states sometimes things just cant fit in? The group has presented wonderful posts with possible alternate theories as to why certain events happen when they do and their arguments are a great source of entertainment for me! Its hard for me to believe that I havent run into a situation yet that just cant be explained with some intricate research or calendar presentation, as Im sure this Starfox situation can.

The bigger point is what to do when faced with this predicament that just can't be solved??

Charlie

			*	*	*

Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 18, 2003 at 20:33:06:
In Reply to: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
posted by captamr on May 18, 2003 at 12:52:04:

You are correct.  Starfox doesn't "really" appear in SWII 5.  Marvel realized this mistake, and in Official Marvel Index to the Avengers, vol. 2 #5, they list Eros' next appearance after A 261 as SS3 19.

Every now and then, Marvel's writers and editors commit a big boo-boo when it comes to character appearances.  Perhaps the most memorable was Tigra's appearance in A@ 18; she couldn't have appeared in that issue, as she was shrunk by Pym at the time.  Marvel recognized the error in short order, publicly apologized for it, and sure enough, she isn't listed in the entry for A@ 18 in Official Marvel Index to the Avengers, vol. 2 #6.

--Paul

			*	*	*

Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
Posted by captamr on May 18, 2003 at 22:59:36:
In Reply to: Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 18, 2003 at 20:33:06:

Thanks Paul for the confirmation. This seems to indicate a need along side alternate timelines, multiverses, etc. listings for the "Not Really an Appearance" list.

Charlie

			*	*	*

Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 27, 2003 at 08:58:03:
In Reply to: Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
posted by captamr on May 18, 2003 at 22:59:36:

> >   Marvel realized this mistake, and in Official Marvel Index to the Avengers, vol. 2 #5, they list Eros' next appearance after A 261 as SS3 19.

I don't no.  Emperor Doom (Marvel Graphic Novel #27) presents a problem.  If the Hulk appearance in Emperor Doom is canon, the book must be set after Incredible Hulk (vol. 2) #315 which is after Secret Wars II #4.  The current chronology has Starfox leaving the Avengers in Avengers (vol. 1) #261, before they fight the Beyonder in Secret Wars II #4.  So if the Starfox appearances in Emperor Doom are canon (a non-speaking role, but addressed by name), Emperor Doom must be set either before Avengers #256 or Starfox decided to return to Earth shortly after the rest of the Avengers and was caught up in the events of Secret Wars II #4 (where he does have a speaking role) and 5 and Emperor Doom.  If both the Hulk and Starfox appearances are canon, then Emperor Doom must be after Secret Wars II #4.  If we accept the editorial guide that Emperor Doom takes place before West Coast Avengers (vol. 2) #1 as true (due to the absence of Hank Pym, I suppose), then Emperor Doom must take place before Secret Wars II #5 as well as Vision and the Scarlet Witch (vol. 2) #1.

With this in mind, I propose the following changes in the chronologies:

Purple Man - last in Marvel Team-Up Annual #4
Dr. Doom - last in Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars #12
Namor, the Sub-Mariner - last in Avengers (vol. 1) #263
Vision - last in Avengers (vol. 1) #255
Wonder Man - last in Captain America (vol. 1) #308 behind the scenes
Hawkeye - last in Iron Man (vol. 1) #201
Mockingbird - last in Iron Man (vol. 1) #201
Tigra - last in Iron Man (vol. 1) #201
Iron Man - last in Iron Man (vol. 1) #201
Jarvis - last in Fantastic Four (vol. 1) #286
Starfox - last in Secret Wars II #4
Scarlet Witch - last in Avengers (vol. 1) #255
Machine Man - last in Iron Man (vol. 1) #168
Ultron - last in the flashback to West Coast Avengers (vol. 2) #7
Captain America - last in Fantastic Four (vol. 1) #286
Wasp - last in Avengers (vol. 1) #263
Luke Cage, Power Man - last in Power Man and Iron Fist #117
Hulk - last in Marvel Fanfare (vol. 1) #29
Black Knight IV - last in Avengers (vol. 1) #263

When the prism is destroyed at the end of Emperor Doom, several characters appear.  Currently, they are uncredited in the Marvel Chronology Project.  If these are actual appearances, I submit the following changes to the chronologies:

Magneto - last in Uncanny X-Men #201 (and yes, I am proposing that Uncanny X-Men #199-201, Uncanny X-Men Annual #9, New Mutants #35, and New Mutants Special Edition #1 be moved before Secret Wars II #5.)
Storm
Wolverine
Dr. Strange - last in Longshot (vol. 1) #6
Thing - last in Thing #29
Spider-Man - last in either Longshot (vol. 1) #4 or Web of Spider-Man Annual #1
Daredevil - last in Daredevil (vol. 1) #223
Captain Marvel II - last in Avengers (vol. 1) #263
She-Hulk - last in Fantastic Four (vol. 1) #286
Mr. Fantastic - last in Fantastic Four (vol. 1) #286
Invisible Woman - last in Fantastic Four (vol. 1) #286

			*	*	*

Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 27, 2003 at 20:59:23:
In Reply to: Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
posted by Andy Holcombe on May 27, 2003 at 08:58:03:

> I don't no.  Emperor Doom (Marvel Graphic Novel #27) presents a problem.

Hmm.  The Official Marvel Indexes appear to ignore the Emperor Doom graphic novel.  Is this an unintentional omission or evidence that Marvel doesn't consider the graphic novel to be canon?

			*	*	*

Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 28, 2003 at 07:58:00:
In Reply to: Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 27, 2003 at 20:59:23:

> Hmm.  The Official Marvel Indexes appear to ignore the Emperor Doom graphic novel.

Emperor Doom is dated 1987 so it may have been too recent for the intitial round of Official Marvel Indices.  Now, why it wasn't listed in the follow-up, I don't know.

			*	*	*

Emperor Doom: Oversight or Non-Canon?
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 28, 2003 at 20:11:09:
In Reply to: Re: Irreconcilable Incongruity!!
posted by Andy Holcombe on May 28, 2003 at 07:58:00:

Yes, the appropriate index would have been Official Marvel Index to the Avengers, v2 #5, with a publication date of February, 1995.  So you have to wonder...

			*	*	*

Re: Emperor Doom: Oversight or Non-Canon?
Posted by DCW3 on May 29, 2003 at 12:39:38:
In Reply to: Emperor Doom: Oversight or Non-Canon?
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 28, 2003 at 20:11:09:

The Purple Man's "death" in "Emperor Doom" is referenced in his entry in the OHotMU, which would indicate that it was at least considered canon at that time. 

			*	*	*

X-Mas & the X-Men
Posted by RLG on May 18, 2003 at 20:57:05:

  Is the Christmas mentioned in the aftermath of the FALL OF THE MUTANTS storylines the same Christmas as the one refered to in the aftermath of INFERNO? 

The (1st) Christmas is refered to in X-Factor #27, where Iceman makes a X-Mas tree sculpture on the battle-damaged Empire State Building. The Christmas season is also referenced in Daredevil #253 (#252 was a FALL of.. tie-in.)

The (2nd) Christmas is refered to in Fantastic Four #325 and Amazing Spider-Man #314, in which Peter and Mary Jane are evicted from Bedford Towers. In both titles, the previous issue was an INFERNO tie-in.

Could it be that FALL of the MUTANTS occurs early December (still the holiday season) and INFERNO occuring closer to X-mas day?  The other possibility is that they are two seperate holidays a year apart.

If they are the same holiday, Spider-Man's chronlogy gets pretty muddled up - 1)Spidey is put in the Mad Dog Ward, 2)has his first encounter with Venom, #3)moves into Bedford Towers, 4)decides to return to college, 5)WEBS is published and Pete goes on a book-signing tour, 6)Tombstone breaks Robbie's neck, and 7)MJ is kidnapped - all in the space of one month's time!

On the other hand, if they are two separate holidays (a year apart), then the time Ben Grimm was leader of the FF (starting circa FF #306 and ending circa FF #326) would be just over a year.

Of course, one of these Christmas references could be "topical", but if so, which one?

			*	*	*

More appearances by "The Foreigner"?
Posted by John Omohundro on May 19, 2003 at 12:00:58:

Gentlemen:

Would any of you know if "The Foreigner" has made any more appearances since his last appearance in SILVER SABLE AND THE WILD PACK, Volume 1, Issue #25 (June, 1994)?

Just asking. :)

			*	*	*

Wolverine's chronological age?
Posted by John Omohundro on May 19, 2003 at 14:12:43:

Gentlemen:

Has anyone ever established the approximate (or exact) chronological age of Wolverine, a/k/a "Logan" (birth name, according to "ORIGIN" Issues Number 1--6, James "Jamie" Howlett)?

According to that series, he was born in Ireland, and emigrated to North America sometime in the mid- to late- Nineteenth Century--if I remember my history correctly, the last major wave of Irish immigration into North America was in the late 1840's, following the so-called "Potato Famine". That would be about right, because the book shows him working in a gold-mining camp as a young man, and the first major gold strike in the U.S. was at Sutter's Mill, California, in 1848. (Although there was a later strike in the Alaskan Klondike and the Canadian Yukon territories in 1896 or so. As the end of ORIGIN #6 clearly shows him running off into the Canadian wilderness, I would presume that the latter scenario is the more likely one.)

However, in a recent issue of the comics (unfortunately, I can't remember if it was an issue of WOLVERINE, or one of the X-titles), he mentioned that he knew Jim Beam, the whiskey distiller, PERSONALLY.

According to their Website, www.jimbeam.com, Colonel James B. Beam, the fourth generation of his family to work in that business (they're currently on the sixth generation) was born in 1864 and died in 1937.

It is, I suppose, possible that he could have known him late in his life, especially since it is canonical MARVEL history that Logan was around as far back as 1941 (just prior to the U.S.'s entry into World War II), and that he served as a member of the First Special Service Force ("The Devil's Brigade") later in the War, and was a paratrooper on D-Day (June 6, 1944).

Anyway, between the ORIGIN series and everything else I know about him, I've been able to rougly estimate Wolverine's actual age at somewhere between 100 and 200 years, which is possible given (1) that his healing factor causes him to age at a much slower rate than normal humans, and (2) that he, along with the other members of the group he worked with in Department H (Maverick, Silver Fox, Sabretooth, et al.) was treated with an age-suppression factor of some sort, which further slowed his aging process.

Would any of you have any information that could help me get a more exact estimate?

Thanks for any help. :)

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Re: Wolverine's chronological age?
Posted by Jeph! on May 19, 2003 at 16:21:31:
In Reply to: Wolverine's chronological age?
posted by John Omohundro on May 19, 2003 at 14:12:43:

Here's a simple answer: according to the gravestone in issue #2, James' older brother, John Howlett, was born in 1885, and died in 1897.

That means that James "Logan" Howlett was born AFTER 1885.

Also, Origin #1 shows James' mother wearing mourning black in her first appearance -- that means it's likely 1897 or 1898 when Rose comes to live with the Howletts.  Young James looks around, what, eight to ten in those early scenes?  It's hard to tell, but he grows up to be not considerably younger than Rose, who is twelve in Origin #1.

One can assume, then, that Wolverine was born between 1887 and 1890...

-Jeph!

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Wolverine born in Ireland???
Posted by French Thom on June 02, 2003 at 18:02:34:
In Reply to: Wolverine's chronological age?
posted by John Omohundro on May 19, 2003 at 14:12:43:

John Omohundro wrote:

> According to that series (ORIGIN), he was born in Ireland,

(I'm sorry but did I miss a page of the series? I've just double checked and saw no reference of jim being born there, neither of him crossing the ocean to go to North America. I understood from my reading that the castle in which he lived WAS in Northern America or Canada, as he just had to get a train to go to gold mines...)

> and emigrated to North America sometime in the mid- to late- Nineteenth Century--if I remember my history correctly, the last major wave of Irish immigration into North America was in the late 1840's, following the so-called "Potato Famine".

(If i'm correct, i remember from the Scorsese movie "Gangs of New York" that Irish people were still coming by millions by that time, 1868 if my souvenir is accurate.)

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Nah.
Posted by Jeph! on June 03, 2003 at 12:35:26:
In Reply to: Wolverine born in Ireland???
posted by French Thom on June 02, 2003 at 18:02:34:

> (I'm sorry but did I miss a page of the series? I've just double checked and saw no reference of jim being born there, neither of him crossing the ocean to go to North America.

You didn't miss anything.  The original poster was mistaken.

> I understood from my reading that the castle in which he lived WAS in Northern America or Canada, as he just had to get a train to go to gold mines...)

The Howlett house was somewhere in Canada.  When fleeing by train, a sleepy John asks Rose "are we still in Canada?", implying that's where they started -- and Wolvie's been referring to himself as a native Canadian for years, and it would be a shame to assume he was mistaken.

-Jeph!

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Re: Nah.
Posted by Ashley on July 17, 2003 at 09:48:50:
In Reply to: Nah.
posted by Jeph! on June 03, 2003 at 12:35:26:

Jeph is quite right to tell you the truth. Wolverine has always been a Canadian, everyone including marvel writers state that he's a full blood canadian, which make me proud to be one too.

As you all know he took on his grandfatehrs name Logan in order to be protected. WHy he never went back to using James, is beyond me.. he could have easily destroyed anyone who attacked him:P

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Re: Wolverine's chronological age?
Posted by John Omohundro on May 19, 2003 at 16:31:01:

Jeph!--

Thanks.

I guess I wasn't paying close enough attention when I read the ORIGIN series.

As I'd said, I figured the ol' Canucklehead was somewhere between 100 and 150 years old, but I wasn't certain where he fell within that time span.

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Hulk Chronology Just Before Contest of Champions
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 20, 2003 at 00:22:03:

Here's a proposed revamp/streamline of the Hulk's chronology leading up to the Contest of Champions.  As it stands now, there are three breaks in Bill Mantlo's story from Incredible Hulk #254 to #269.  I'm not proposing to move Contest of Champions, just everything else Hulk related.

Here we go

The Hulk returns to the US in the first story of Incredible Hulk #262.  After that, or the second story in that issue, he responds to Clea's summons as depicted in the flashback in Defenders #99.  After Defenders #101, the Hulk moves to Upstate New York for Hulk! 26 and 27/1 as well as Dazzler #6 and 7.  I don't suppose the order here matters.  Then he responds to the summons to Nighthawk and Valkyrie's funerals and their adventure on the Squadron Supreme's Earth in Defenders #107-115.  Following his return to Marvel Earth in Defenders #115, the Hulk sets out to return to the West Coast.  Along the way, he visits Las Vegas in Hulk! #27/2 and a US ICBM field in Incredible Hulk Annual #10.  This dumps him back in the Pacific Ocean where his series picks up with either Incredible Hulk #262/2 or 263 with the Hulk in California.  Once the Hulk/Banner reunites with Rick Jones and Betty Talbot in #263, I don't think we can break the story.  I would also like to move Marvel Two-in-One Annual #7 and #96 and 97 and Fantastic Four #258 after Incredible Hulk #284 and Avengers #227.  This, of course, also requires moving the first Vision and the Scarlet Witch limited series after Incredible Hulk #284 as well.

Ideally, I would like to move the non-Incredible Hulk appearances back to between #253 and 254 giving the Hulk an uninterupted (not counting a couple of seconds for the Contest of Champions) run from #254-284, but I don't have access to #253-260 right now.  Nor can I currently check Marvel Fanfare #7 and 17 or The Death of Captain Marvel.  I don't even have Marvel Team-Up #104, 105 and 111 or Questprobe #1.

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What date did the Avengers band together?
Posted by Kevin  on May 20, 2003 at 11:37:47:

I just reread Avengers v. 3 issue #10 and 11 again, and in those issues, they're celebrating the anniversary of the Avengers founding.  Issue 10 was published in the month of Sept. 1998.  The original Avengers issue 1 was published in Sept. of 1963, correct?  Since I don't have the original Olshevsky calender, I'm just wondering: what date did the Avengers band together on the calender?  Was it in Sept?  I ask because every time Marvel celebrates an anniversary, (within the context of the story) it's on the publishing date.  I was just wondering if the publishing dates matched up to the dates on Olshevsky's calender....

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Re: What date did the Avengers band together?
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 20, 2003 at 22:02:26:
In Reply to: What date did the Avengers band together?
posted by Kevin  on May 20, 2003 at 11:37:47:

To quote Olshevsky in Official Index to the Fantastic Four #2: "Toward the end of summer vacation, the Fantastic Four make a brief appearance in AVENGERS #1.  The active assistance of the Teen Brigade in that story indicates it is still summer."  I would say late August.

We'll see how this pans out as I extend the current calendar back to A3 10-11...

--Paul

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Re: What date did the Avengers band together?
Posted by Kevin  on May 21, 2003 at 13:55:58:
In Reply to: Re: What date did the Avengers band together?
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 20, 2003 at 22:02:26:

Thanks for the response.  I was looking over my old Avengers issues, and was wondering about that.  Reading some of these older Avengers issues has got my creative juices going, and I came to some conclusions.

Thinking about this calender further, I've realized that your current calender starts just prior to Oct. 2000, (just prior to Maximum Security) and it up to date not, nearly 3 years later.  And I show going by your latest calender that you've covered nearly a year and a half of Marvel Time.  So it seems that roughly a year and a half of Marvel time equals 3 years of real time.  

So I got to thinking about this further: 3 years prior to Maximum Security was Oct. of 97: the Heroes Reborn event.  If 3 years real time equals 1.5 of Marvel Time, then taking your calender back 16-18 months would place Heroes Return around Feb./March/April of the prior year.  That sounds right, as there was some snow on the ground in the first issue of Avengers. vol. 3, issue #1.   I bring this up because going by how there has to be gaps inbetween story arcs of Avengers to accomidate Cap/Iron Man/ and Thor's titles, then A3 10 and 11 could concievable be in late Aug./early Sept.  Which seems to be right where George Olshevsky has the anniversary date of the Avengers banding together.

Sorry, just thinking this over, and plotting how far back we can take this calender.  Of course, I haven't taken into consideration Xmen and Spidey continuity from this period, and how that might affect an overall calender.  

Hmmm...you're right, let's come back to this at a later date.  :-)

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Re: What date did the Avengers band together?
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 22, 2003 at 21:21:09:
In Reply to: Re: What date did the Avengers band together?
posted by Kevin  on May 21, 2003 at 13:55:58:

In the back of my head, I'm thinking that the Avengers anniversary in A3 10-11 would fit into late August/early September of the year prior to the start of the calendar we're working on now.  AND the Avengers anniversary in THE CROSSING would fit one year before that.  (The whole Heroes Reborn thing would occur between those two anniversaries.) Offhand I think this will work, but we'll see as we plow through the details later.

> Sorry, just thinking this over, and plotting how far back we can take this calender.  

All the way back to FF 1, Kevin...

> Hmmm...you're right, let's come back to this at a later date.  :-)

...but, yes, let's not get ahead of ourselves.

--Paul

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Re: What date did the Avengers band together?
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 30, 2003 at 07:33:12:
In Reply to: Re: What date did the Avengers band together?
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 22, 2003 at 21:21:09:

Addendum to the other postings...

According to The Official Marvel Index to the Avengers, vol. 1 #1 (page 48), the Avengers banded together in September.  This, combined with the statement in the Fantastic Four index that the Avengers banded together late during summer vacation leads me to place A 1 on September 1 or 2.  (I'm leaning towards Sept. 1)

--Paul

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Red Skull (Malik) ;a phony flashback in Amazing Spider-Man#366
Posted by John McDonagh on May 20, 2003 at 16:12:47:

Since the people claiming to be Peter's parents in Amazing Spider-Man#366 turned out to be robotic impostors, does not the appearance of Red Skull (Albert Malik) amount to a phony flashback?

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Re: Red Skull (Malik) ;a phony flashback in Amazing Spider-Man#366
Posted by drew on May 21, 2003 at 20:39:36:
In Reply to: Red Skull (Malik) ;a phony flashback in Amazing Spider-Man#366
posted by John McDonagh on May 20, 2003 at 16:12:47:

In ASM #367 spider-man finds a computer with information about the red skull and his operatives and discovers that the flashback was correct, at least form the red skulls point of view. Also, in ASM # 388 Chameleon says "Any gaps in their memories could be explained by the 20 years they'd spent in russian prison camps." this could mean that Chameleon found out as much accurate information as he could on Peter's Parents then installed it into their memories. if the flash back is false then both the Chameleon and the red skull have false information. Im led to bleieve that the flashback did happen unless the red skull AND the chameleon did some note sharing to really screw over spider-man or there is something in ASM@5 that would say the flashback never happened. can anybody agree/disagree with this theory or provide some feedback about ASM@5.

thanks, 

 drew

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NORTHSTAR...MICHAEL O'BRIEN....ODDBALL
Posted by Arthur Stein on May 21, 2003 at 20:18:29:

new entries marked **

NORTHSTAR/JEAN-PAUL BAUBIER
AF 91
**AF 92 (pg 8)
AF 93

O'BRIEN, MICHAEL 
A 319/2
**A 322/2 (seated at table with John Jameson and Edwin Jarvis Viewed on security monitor and identified by Peggy Carter, Pg 27/4  - 27/5)
A 323/2

ODDBALL/ELTON HEALEY
ASPOT 25
**CA 395 (unnamed, but in costume, Pg 9/1)
HAWK2

Note to newcomers. Just to explain what my postings areas an avid Marvelist I had my own version of this Marvel Chronology Project (MCP). I am now comparing the two, and for all character entries in the MCP, I am checking if I have any appearances that may have been overlooked. Validating them. Chronologizing them. Posting them (so others have an opportunity to refute or comment). The aim... to help in the completeness of this magnificent piece of information engineering! 

#89

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DC Comics
Posted by playa on May 22, 2003 at 14:46:23:

Hello folks:

I was just wondering if there is a DC Chronology Project out there that I can look at? What is its web site address? If not, will there eventually be one?

Thanks for your time.

Best wishes,

Albert

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Re: DC Comics
Posted by Cook on May 22, 2003 at 19:07:11:
In Reply to: DC Comics
posted by playa on May 22, 2003 at 14:46:23:

http://www.comicboards.com/dcguide/DCP/main.htm

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Re: DC Comics
Posted by playa on May 23, 2003 at 13:38:16:
In Reply to: Re: DC Comics
posted by Cook on May 22, 2003 at 19:07:11:

Thanks for the info, Cook.

Best wishes,

Playa

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need help
Posted by lgwjr on May 24, 2003 at 10:47:33:

first off..great site..it was recomended by a collector(Dan from Impulse Creations)..I have been collecting the X-Men Onslaught and associated titles over the years..not for money just for pleasure..I recently misplaced my check list and I knew I was a few titles short..hence my finding your site through asking different collectors..anyways..my question or problem is this...after checking through your list there seems on my part some confusion..the same title is listed more than once was wondering if this is a misprint..and more importantly can somebody give me the complete list?..feel free to e-mail me..also..wondering if anyone remembers the old Mighty Marvel Marching Society..The Avengers from the mid 60's..yes I'm an old guy..*L*..and if theres anyway to get copies of them????

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Re: need help
Posted by Administrator on May 24, 2003 at 21:11:45:
In Reply to: need help
posted by lgwjr on May 24, 2003 at 10:47:33:

> after checking through your list there seems on my part some confusion..the same title is listed more than once was wondering if this is a misprint...

Maybe, maybe not. Where do you find the same title listed more than once?

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Re: need help
Posted by lgwjr on May 26, 2003 at 05:54:40:
In Reply to: Re: need help
posted by Administrator on May 24, 2003 at 21:11:45:

X-55 is listed more than once..and clear which is X-Men or X-Man..thank you for your response

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Re: need help
Posted by Administrator on May 26, 2003 at 09:40:54:
In Reply to: Re: need help
posted by lgwjr on May 26, 2003 at 05:54:40:

> X-55 is listed more than once..and clear which is X-Men or X-Man..thank you for your response

Well, we need more information than that.

If you found "X-55" listed (note the hyphen), that's probably a mistake. Specifically, where in the Project is it listed?

If you mean "X 55", it *should* be listed more than once--many times, in fact--at least once for each character who appeared therein.

If you found X 55 listed more than once in one character's chronology, again, maybe it's a mistake, maybe not. A character can appear in any number of stories _in between pages_ of X 55. We won't know which unless we know specifically where you found the double listing.

And X 55 refers to X-Men 55. For other questions about our acronyms and abbreviations, read the FAQ and the Key. The links are to the left.

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Re: need help
Posted by lgwjr on May 26, 2003 at 14:25:49:
In Reply to: Re: need help
posted by Administrator on May 26, 2003 at 09:40:54:

thank you I just explored more of your site..whew..lots of work you guys have done..

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Marvel Double Shots
Posted by SKleefeld on May 24, 2003 at 21:25:30:

Hi, all --

Paul B. and I have been kicking around placement for some of the Marvel Double Shots issues. Some of them have proved to be very problematic (for us, at least) and so we thought we'd solicit responses from everybody on some of these...

MDS 1/1 -- A simple Hulk story. Point 1) Betty *Ross* is shown in the story. As in, not married, and not dead. Point 2) She-Hulk cameos. It's only one panel, but it's kind of a plot-point. Neither Paul nor I know our Hulk history that well to place this story anywhere other than sometime after She-Hulk's origin, but before Betty and Bruce's wedding. Anyone have any insights?

MDS 2/2 -- The Simpsonesque Avengers. Canon or not?

MDS 4/2 -- Dr. Strange. The "current" part of the story occurs when? I'm not aware of too many other recent Dr. Stange appearances after The Order. (One or two issues of ASM I think.) And how about the flashback... How much time is after he gets the Eye of Agamotto but before his Cloak of Leviation?

Thanks!

-- Sean

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Re: Marvel Double Shots
Posted by Kevin  on May 25, 2003 at 16:38:15:
In Reply to: Marvel Double Shots
posted by SKleefeld on May 24, 2003 at 21:25:30:

> MDS 1/1 -- A simple Hulk story. Point 1) Betty *Ross* is shown in the story. As in, not married, and not dead. Point 2) She-Hulk cameos. It's only one panel, but it's kind of a plot-point. Neither Paul nor I know our Hulk history that well to place this story anywhere other than sometime after She-Hulk's origin, but before Betty and Bruce's wedding. Anyone have any insights?

Though I'm no expert, I'm pretty familiar with Hulk/She-Hulk/Avengers chronology from this era, (the early to mid 80's that is), but alas, I don't have this issue.  I can search for it, but perhaps if either you or Paul could give me a brief synopsis, I could find a chronological place for it.  

For instance, what's the Hulk that appears in this issue?  Is it classic Stupid Hulk, or is it the Hulk with Banner's mind that Bill Mantlo wrote for a couple years in the mid 80's?  Does Banner appear at all?

You say She Hulk cameos?  What outfit is she wearing?  The Ripped up white shirt outfit (if you can call those tatters an outfit) from her original series?  Her Avengers outfit? Her FF outfit?  Does she make referrence to the Avengers or the FF?

You mention Betty Ross.  What's her attitude towards the Hulk in this story?  Does she know Banner is the Hulk, (though I believe everyone knew that bit of info by the mid 80's)?

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Re: Marvel Double Shots
Posted by SKleefeld on May 26, 2003 at 14:46:05:
In Reply to: Re: Marvel Double Shots
posted by Kevin  on May 25, 2003 at 16:38:15:

> Though I'm no expert, I'm pretty familiar with Hulk/She-Hulk/Avengers chronology from this era, (the early to mid 80's that is), but alas, I don't have this issue.  I can search for it, but perhaps if either you or Paul could give me a brief synopsis, I could find a chronological place for it.  

> For instance, what's the Hulk that appears in this issue?  Is it classic Stupid Hulk, or is it the Hulk with Banner's mind that Bill Mantlo wrote for a couple years in the mid 80's?  Does Banner appear at all?

The story is told from Banner's POV, but we don't actually SEE Bruce anywhere in the story. There's very little dialogue, so it's implied that we've got the "classic" Stupid Hulk, but that's not necessarily set in stone.

The captions do say something about Banner's memory getting hazy once he transforms, if that helps any.

> You say She Hulk cameos?  What outfit is she wearing?  The Ripped up white shirt outfit (if you c can call those tatters an outfit) from her original series?  Her Avengers outfit? Her FF outfit?  Does she make referrence to the Avengers or the FF?

She's only in one panel. The basic premise of the story is that some kid uses some of her blood to create a "Hulk Spray." He then blackmails Banner to get to the real Hulk to make a more potent version. Bruce calls Betty to tell her where Jen is being held, and Betty call her dad. The rest of the issue is a 3-way slugfest between the army/Gen. Ross, the Hulk and this kid. The kid dies, the army cleans up, and Hulk leaps off into the desert.

The only shot we have of She-Hulk, she's unconscious, strapped to a hospital gurney with an IV stuck in her. She's wearing a hospital gown.

> You mention Betty Ross.  What's her attitude towards the Hulk in this story?  Does she know Banner is the Hulk, (though I believe everyone knew that bit of info by the mid 80's)?

Betty also only appears for one panel. Bruce phones her and tells her where to find Jen. Although in the story, he just refers to her as "his cousin" and doesn't  really indicate whether Betty knows about his OR Jennifer's alter egos.

In fact, it doesn't even say IF Betty is able to find Jennifer. It just says she calls her dad right after she gets off the phone with Bruce. 

This is partially why I'm having problems placing it!  :)

-- Sean

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Re: Marvel Double Shots
Posted by Kevin  on May 26, 2003 at 23:39:12:
In Reply to: Re: Marvel Double Shots
posted by SKleefeld on May 26, 2003 at 14:46:05:

> > For instance, what's the Hulk that appears in this issue?  Is it classic Stupid Hulk, or is it the Hulk with Banner's mind that Bill Mantlo wrote for a couple years in the mid 80's?  Does Banner appear at all?

> The story is told from Banner's POV, but we don't actually SEE Bruce anywhere in the story. There's very little dialogue, so it's implied that we've got the "classic" Stupid Hulk, but that's not necessarily set in stone.

> The captions do say something about Banner's memory getting hazy once he transforms, if that helps any.<p>That would definently be a description of Banner's transforming into the Classic Stupid Hulk.  Banner remembers little while in his Stupid Hulk Mode.

Which means that this IS NOT the Hulk with Banner's mind that first appeared around Hulk #272, (circa 1982) and ran for the next couple years.  I don't have exact publication dates in front of me, and am going by memory alone.  Around 1985, or possibly late '84 (around the time of Secret Wars) the Stupid Hulk comes back.  Further details given below...

> > You say She Hulk cameos?  What outfit is she wearing?  The Ripped up white shirt outfit (if you c can call those tatters an outfit) from her original series?  Her Avengers outfit? Her FF outfit?  Does she make referrence to the Avengers or the FF?

> She's only in one panel. The basic premise of the story is that some kid uses some of her blood to create a "Hulk Spray." He then blackmails Banner to get to the real Hulk to make a more potent version. Bruce calls Betty to tell her where Jen is being held, and Betty call her dad. The rest of the issue is a 3-way slugfest between the army/Gen. Ross, the Hulk and this kid. The kid dies, the army cleans up, and Hulk leaps off into the desert.

> The only shot we have of She-Hulk, she's unconscious, strapped to a hospital gurney with an IV stuck in her. She's wearing a hospital gown.

How peculiar...is there any mention of locations?  She-Hulk in her original series, (issues 1 *1979* to 25 *1982* ) was based out in Los Angeles.  At the end of her series, she's decided to become a full fledged adventurer, and given up being Jennifer Walters, Attorney at Law.  She's seen roaming the Southwest in cameo appearances in a couple of books, living the party girl lifestyle, before joining the Avengers in Avengers #221.  This is the start of She-Hulk being used as a comedy character by the way.  

You mention the battle is fought in the desert, so is there clues that Jen was being held relatively nearby?  What's the description Banner gives Betty of where she's held?  It sounds like all this happens in the Southwest, so this would sound to me like Jen was captured while roaming the countryside, PRIOR to her joining the Avengers in Avengers #221.  After all, why wouldn't the Avengers come to her aid, with her being kidnapped?

This would also place these events PRIOR to Hulk #269, which culminates with Banner becoming Hulk-with-Banner's-mind around Hulk #272. 

There's really no chance for this story to be set after Hulk #272, because the next two years feature a smart Hulk with Banner's mind, followed afterword by Banner losing control and the Stupid Hulk gaining control of the body around Hulk #297 and staying as the Hulk, a phase which last till (after going on a trip across dimensions) Banner finally regains control of his body and returns to Earth around Hulk #313.  In Hulk #315, Banner is SPLIT from the Hulk, and thinking himself cured, he marries Betty Ross in Hulk #319.  So I'm just getting the feeling this story occurs before all this storyline occurs: in otherwords, before Hulk #269, (circa 1982).

> > You mention Betty Ross.  What's her attitude towards the Hulk in this story?  Does she know Banner is the Hulk, (though I believe everyone knew that bit of info by the mid 80's)?

> Betty also only appears for one panel. Bruce phones her and tells her where to find Jen. Although in the story, he just refers to her as "his cousin" and doesn't  really indicate whether Betty knows about his OR Jennifer's alter egos.

> In fact, it doesn't even say IF Betty is able to find Jennifer. It just says she calls her dad right after she gets off the phone with Bruce. 

And yet, someone found her, right?  Because she was in a hospital?  And I remembered:  Everyone knows that Banner is the Hulk by this time.  That was revealed to the world in the mid to late 70's.  

Could you please write down the exact conversation had between Banner and Betty on the phone?  Banner and Betty had a falling out around the time Banner became "Hulk with Banner's brain", because he decided to remain a hero using the Hulk's strength during that period, whereas Betty wanted him to work towards finding a cure for the Hulk.  But if they're on somewhat friendly terms, it further strengthens my thinking (as it stands right now) that this is set circa 1982, before Hulk gets smart, and before Jen joins the Avengers, (is also sounds from the way you describe it that Betty hasn't met Jen yet: judging by the way he simply describes her as 'his cousin').

> This is partially why I'm having problems placing it!  :)

Yes, but I'm beginning to form a picture of when this story is set.  I'll get back to you....

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Re: Marvel Double Shots
Posted by SKleefeld on May 27, 2003 at 07:29:07:
In Reply to: Re: Marvel Double Shots
posted by Kevin  on May 26, 2003 at 23:39:12:

> How peculiar...is there any mention of locations?  She-Hulk in her original series, (issues 1 *1979* to 25 *1982* ) was based out in Los Angeles.  At the end of her series, she's decided to become a full fledged adventurer, and given up being Jennifer Walters, Attorney at Law.  She's seen roaming the Southwest in cameo appearances in a couple of books, living the party girl lifestyle, before joining the Avengers in Avengers #221.  This is the start of She-Hulk being used as a comedy character by the way.  

No mention anywhere of where Jen is. One would PRESUME somewhere in southwest, but there's absolutely no evidence in the story where she actually is.

> You mention the battle is fought in the desert, so is there clues that Jen was being held relatively nearby?  What's the description Banner gives Betty of where she's held?  It sounds like all this happens in the Southwest, so this would sound to me like Jen was captured while roaming the countryside, PRIOR to her joining the Avengers in Avengers #221.  After all, why wouldn't the Avengers come to her aid, with her being kidnapped?

> This would also place these events PRIOR to Hulk #269, which culminates with Banner becoming Hulk-with-Banner's-mind around Hulk #272. 

> And yet, someone found her, right?  Because she was in a hospital?   

Actually we don't even know that much. Jen isn't shown in a hospital, just on a gurney with an IV. There's no background artwork to even suggest that it's a hospital. For all we know, it was the kid's shed, and Jen eventually woke up on her own.

> Could you please write down the exact conversation had between Banner and Betty on the phone?  Banner and Betty had a falling out around the time Banner became "Hulk with Banner's brain", because he decided to remain a hero using the Hulk's strength during that period, whereas Betty wanted him to work towards finding a cure for the Hulk.  But if they're on somewhat friendly terms, it further strengthens my thinking (as it stands right now) that this is set circa 1982, before Hulk gets smart, and before Jen joins the Avengers, (is also sounds from the way you describe it that Betty hasn't met Jen yet: judging by the way he simply describes her as 'his cousin').

There was no actual conversation. The captions said something to the effect of, "I [Bruce] phoned Betty Ross and told her where my cousin was. She, in turn, called her father, General Thunderbolt Ross."

-- Sean


			*	*	*

Re: Marvel Double Shots
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 27, 2003 at 09:28:53:
In Reply to: Re: Marvel Double Shots
posted by SKleefeld on May 27, 2003 at 07:29:07:

Glen Talbot dies in Incredible Hulk (vol. 2) #260.  Betty Ross joins Rick Jones in his search for the Hulk in #261 or 262.  They meet the Hulk/Banner in #263.  They spend #264-267 travelling to the deactivated Gamma Base.  In #269, events are set in motion that lead to the Hulk with Banner's brain in #272.  General Thunderbolt Ross returns to active duty in #264.  My vote is to set the Marvel Double Shot story between #267 and 269.  There's an indefinite time span for the Hulk during these three issues.

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Re: Marvel Double Shots
Posted by Kevin  on May 27, 2003 at 13:30:26:
In Reply to: Re: Marvel Double Shots
posted by Andy Holcombe on May 27, 2003 at 09:28:53:

Couldn't have said it better myself.  I would put Banner/Hulk appearing in this story just prior to Hulk #269, and She-Hulk appearing here after She Hulk #25, but before Avengers #221.  But again, this is just my humble opinion, and nothing more.

Thanks for the detailed info Sean!

			*	*	*

Re: Marvel Double Shots
Posted by garbonzo on May 25, 2003 at 20:18:22:
In Reply to: Marvel Double Shots
posted by SKleefeld on May 24, 2003 at 21:25:30:

> MDS 2/2 -- The Simpsonesque Avengers. Canon or not?

When I first looked at the story, I thought "nope, not cannon."  Then, after I read it, I thought, "why not?"  There is nothing in the story that is blatantly out of character for any of the characters present (aside from it being a bit goofy, but there have been some goofy issues in the past!)

As a suggested placement, how about between A3 55 and A3 56?  In issue 55 Thor leaves (without a beard) and returns (without a beard) to throw a feast for the Avengers.  In issue 56, Thor is  back in the mansion (this time he has a beard as is seen in Double Shot #2).  Jarvis makes him a sandwich, using what appears to be leftovers of what could be the boar seen in issue 55.

As for the rest of the characters, they are all present in issues 55 and or 56 (except the Black Knight?) so that doesn't seem to cause a continuity problem either.

All in all, I am willing to go for cannon on this one.  Any thoughts?

garbonzo

			*	*	*

Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
Posted by Jeph! on May 25, 2003 at 21:18:14:
In Reply to: Re: Marvel Double Shots
posted by garbonzo on May 25, 2003 at 20:18:22:

I read the Simpsons-style M/DS #2/2 in the shop, so I can't comment *too* deeply, but:

I agree that this story could probably be considered canon -- I mean, why not?  Yes, Loki is being petty and goofy, but technically he's the god of Mischief, right?  And nobody else is terribly out of character.

> As for the rest of the characters, they are all present in issues 55 and or 56 (except the Black Knight?) so that doesn't seem to cause a continuity problem either.

What about Hawkeye?  He appears in this story too (and in a nice touch, he's shown wearing his Thunderbolts belt buckle).  But is he avilable then?

We placed the Kang War proper (Avengers #46-54, a four-day period) between T-Bolts #63-64.  Avengers #55 takes place three weeks after #54, and #56 takes place a month after that, if memory serves.

Now, Hawkeye isn't really free to hang around with the Avengers until after T-Bolts #75.  So the question is, can T-Bolts #64-75 take place in under two months, to place Hawk back with the Avengers by #56?

(By the way, we have another post-TB #75 Hawkeye reference -- Deadline #2, I believe, where someone claims Hawkeye shot a villain in the leg.  Any clues where this issue hooks into continuity?  I believe, thanks to Ben Urich's comments, the Deadline series takes place before DD's unmasking, and references in Alias place that before *Cap's* unmasking ... but did we decide that Iron Man unmasked after Cap?

I think I remember us deciding on that unmasking order -- DD, Cap, then IM.  If so, and Deadline #1-4 predates them all, then we have ANOTHER clue that Hawkeye was free of the T-Bolts' mission prior to Avengers #56 (where IM's identity is now publicly known).

How does IM's armor design factor in, by the way?  Does the design in the Double-Shot story match up to any other suit we've seen him wear?

This COULD work.

-Jeph!

PS - Isn't Hawkeye mentioned in Spider-Man: Sweet Charity?  I think we were waiting until TB #75 to place THAT issue, too ... in case it helps, I've placed the issue (because of Wolvie and Rogue's availability to be auctioned) between X-Treme X-Men #18-19, which falls somewhere near A3 #56 on a timeline...

			*	*	*

Re: Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
Posted by garbonzo on May 25, 2003 at 22:21:41:
In Reply to: Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
posted by Jeph! on May 25, 2003 at 21:18:14:

> How does IM's armor design factor in, by the way?  Does the design in the Double-Shot story match up to any other suit we've seen him wear?

The Iron Man armor appears to be the Grell armor (albeit with a Simpsons bend to it), so that fits as well, no?

garbonzo

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Re: Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 29, 2003 at 17:01:02:
In Reply to: Re: Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
posted by garbonzo on May 25, 2003 at 22:21:41:

I'll give this another shot, as my previous post did not make it into the list (even though it's there)...

By my reckoning, M/DS 2/2 occurs between A3 61 and 62. Here's why:

1) The big giveaway -- the Falcon's costume in M/DS 2/2 is the one first introduced in A3 57 (Cap makes a big deal of the new costume in that issue)

2) Ant-Man is not here, so it is likely M/DS 2/2 occurs before he joins the Avengers in A3 62

3) Black Panther is not here, so it is likely M/DS 2/2 occurs while he's dealing with the death of his future self in his own title, after A3 61

4) Hawkeye -- yes he's visiting the Avengers sometime after TB 75

5) Black Knight -- not necessarily a core team member at this time, but the Avengers are a bit of a revolving door in the wake of the Kang War; he may be visiting as well

6) Iron Man -- Grell-Ryan armor, not a problem

7) Thor -- here in the costume first donned in T2 45 and long enough before T2 46 (the storyline leading to Asgard-over-Manhattan) for his hair to grow back

For those following the calendar, I have M/DS 2/2 pegged on July 12-13.

--Paul 

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Re: Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
Posted by Jeph! on May 30, 2003 at 14:14:15:
In Reply to: Re: Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
posted by Paul Bourcier on May 29, 2003 at 17:01:02:

> I'll give this another shot, as my previous post did not make it into the list (even though it's there)...

Your previous post DID make it up -- at least, if you read this board like I do, manually altering the URL up the numbers ... looks like the board needs more maintenance, though.

But, yeah -- good call about Falcon's new costume.  I agree with your placement.  This would mean, BTW, that Hawkeye appears here *after* Deadline #2 ... and probably after Spider-Man: Sweet Charity?  (Where DID we end up placing that?)

Can you refresh my memory about how the Black Panther's series entiwnes with the Avengers series?

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Re: Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
Posted by Paul Bourcier on May 31, 2003 at 11:40:58:
In Reply to: Re: Hawkeye and Marvel Double Shot #2
posted by Jeph! on May 30, 2003 at 14:14:15:

> But, yeah -- good call about Falcon's new costume.  I agree with your placement.  This would mean, BTW, that Hawkeye appears here *after* Deadline #2 ... and probably after Spider-Man: Sweet Charity?  (Where DID we end up placing that?)

We placed Thunderbolts #75 in May, Sweet Charity in June, and Deadline #2 on July 1.  Double Shot #2/2 is on July 12.  So this all works out nicely.

> Can you refresh my memory about how the Black Panther's series entiwnes with the Avengers series?

After Avengers v.3 #61 (on July 10), we have Black Panther v3 #48-49 (with flashbacks)occurring July 11-14.  On the last date, T'Challa gives up the Panther ID.  This explains his absence in Double Shot #2/2 (July 12) and Avengers v3 #62 (July 16).  Kasper Cole's stint as Panther in Black Panther v3 #50-56 occurs "months" later, in October and November.  I have the current storyline in Black Panther occurring before T'Challa's return to the Avengers in that title's current storyline.

--Paul

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Re: Marvel Double Shots
Posted by Paul O'Brien on May 26, 2003 at 05:01:43:
In Reply to: Re: Marvel Double Shots
posted by garbonzo on May 25, 2003 at 20:18:22:

> All in all, I am willing to go for cannon on this one.  Any thoughts?

I agree that the story should be treated as canon.  There doesn't seem to be any overpowering reason why it can't be, and the number of topical costume references suggests a conscious intent to mesh with present-day Marvel rather than just use the "archetypal" versions of the characters.

In a Marvel Universe that includes Damage Control, Slapstick and the Impossible Man Summer Spectaculars, there's really nothing all that outrageous about this story besides the art style.

			*	*	*

ODIN...ONEG...ORPHAN-MAKER
Posted by Arthur Stein on May 25, 2003 at 09:24:15:

new entries marked **

ODIN [ASGARDIAN]
DF 4.8
**T 401 (okay Im guessing a bit re placement here. Story takes place roughly 1000AD)
JIM 110/2
..  ..  ..  ..  ..
T 128
**T 129
T 131
.. .. .. .. ..
T 244
**T 254
T 262
.. .. .. .. ..
T 432-BTS
IG 2
T 441-BTS

ONEG
E 9
**E 10
T 300

ORPHAN-MAKER/"PETER"
SL 9-FB
**XF 33
XF 34
XF 35

..  ..  ..  ..  ..  

UX 267
**GENX 3
GENX 4

Note to newcomers. Just to explain what my postings areas an avid Marvelist I had my own version of this Marvel Chronology Project (MCP). I am now comparing the two, and for all character entries in the MCP, I am checking if I have any appearances that may have been overlooked. Validating them. Chronologizing them. Posting them (so others have an opportunity to refute or comment). The aim... to help in the completeness of this magnificent piece of information engineering! 

#90

			*	*	*

Re: ODIN in INFINITY GAUNTLET - NOT!!!
Posted by Don Campbell on June 20, 2003 at 14:08:21:
In Reply to: ODIN...ONEG...ORPHAN-MAKER
posted by Arthur Stein on May 25, 2003 at 09:24:15:

> new entries marked **

> ODIN [ASGARDIAN]
> T 432-BTS
> IG 2
> T 441-BTS

First, since a sleeping Odin DOES appear in T 432, that appearance should not be listed as BTS.

Second, I'm assumig that IG 2 is what you meant to add to Odin's chronology.  If so, you'd be half-right.  You're right in that it was supposed to be Odin who appeared in IG #2 but wrong since the "Odin" who did appear in that issue COULD NOT have been the real Odin.

In THOR 432, Loki deliberately provoked Thor into killing him.  The shock of this crime seemed to jolt Odin out of his Odin-sleep and he ordered Heimdall to punish Thor.  Respecting Thor's wish that the mortal realm not be left undefended (and since Thor and Eric Masterson had been time-sharing a single body), Heimdall chose to secretly imprison Thor within Eric's mind while giving Eric the power to become a new Thor.

Eric first transformed into Thor III at the end of T 432.  He got a new costume made for himself and went into action for the first time in T 433.  When he took part in the INFINITY GAUNTLET storyline, Eric was still trying to pretend that he was the real/original Thor.  And in T 434-435, Eric told Captain America who he really was and then went to Asgard to ask Heimdall to bring the real Thor back but instead he ended up rescuing the sleeping Odin from Annihilus, killing Annihilus in the process (at least temporarily).

In IG 5, Annihilus was shown leading a swarm of interdimensional scavengers in an attack on Earth.  Even though everything that happened in IG 2-5 was undone by Nebula in IG 6, the fact that Annihilus was shown to be alive and intact in IG 5 means that the whole IG storyline must take place before T 434-435.

Based on these facts, the whole IG storyline must take place, from Eric's perspective, between T 433 and 434.  Therefore Odin's appearance in IG 2 must also take place between those two issues.  The problem lies in the fact that, as revealed in T 454, at the moment that his physical body was killed by Thor in T 432, Loki's spirit fled to Asgard and usurped the body of the sleeping Odin.  From the time that "Odin" awoke from his Odin-sleep and ordered Heimdall to punish Thor (T 432) until Odin was released from Mephisto's soul shroud and reclaimed his own body (T 455), every appearance by "Odin" was actually Loki in Odin's body.  I can only asume that the IG 2 appearance MUST also be an example of Loki pretending to be Odin, presumably with the secret help of his ally, the Norn Queen Karnilla.

Don Campbell

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Re: ODIN in INFINITY GAUNTLET - NOT!!!
Posted by Jeph! on June 22, 2003 at 15:42:42:
In Reply to: Re: ODIN in INFINITY GAUNTLET - NOT!!!
posted by Don Campbell on June 20, 2003 at 14:08:21:

Agreed.  It's gotta be Loki in Odin's body.

The only thing I can say is, doesn't the MCP count any appearance of a character's PHYSICAL BODY, regardless of whether their souls are present or not?

I believe that's how we operate -- so in this case, IG 2 would be an appearance of both Odin AND Loki.

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

Dai Thomas from Captain Britain; where do they show his wife's death during that battle with the Hulk?
Posted by John McDonagh on May 26, 2003 at 11:55:35:

Pikced up Knights of Pendragon I#5 cheap today, and saw that on page 6, they are talking about Dai Thomas; they show a picture of him, much younger, with his daughter Ruthie and his wife Valerie. They mention that Dai got his reputation as "the hero hater" because his wife died in a battle between  metahumans. 

I remembered that in the much earlier published The Daredevils#7 and the Daredevils#8, they show a copy of The Guardian (a real-life British newspaper) that gives a story on Sir James Jaspers. In Daredevils#8, they show this newspaper again, and in the second column, you can see that the reporters quote Dai Thomas in the story. Dai Thomas mention that his wife died in a battle that took place in New York between the Hulk and an unidentified "super-villain".

  Has this ever been shown anywhere? It would be fun if we could nail it down. Did Dai Thomas already have a reputation as the hero hater in those 1970's published Captain Britain stories? I know Marvel Preview#3 was his first appearance. Then again, there are probably a lot of Hulk stories that take place in New York before any point in time we could nail things down to as having taken place in. 

   (By the way, I am sorry if I gave anyone cold flashes if I seemed to be dreding up the old "Marvel UK as canon debates) or photographs as flashbacks debate.) 

			*	*	*

Forge Chronology - FURY 1 listing - Not in key
Posted by John on May 27, 2003 at 15:06:26:

The very first listing in the Forge Chronology is FURY 1.  FURY is not listed in the key.  What is this issue?

			*	*	*

Re: Forge Chronology - FURY 1 listing - Not in key
Posted by Andy Holcombe on May 27, 2003 at 16:18:22:
In Reply to: Forge Chronology - FURY 1 listing - Not in key
posted by John on May 27, 2003 at 15:06:26:

It's a one-shot entitled Fury which is supposed to be the definative take on post-World War II Nick Fury.

			*	*	*

Jewel AKA Jessica Jones
Posted by A Pruett on May 27, 2003 at 15:08:41:

I have been reading Alias by Brian Micheal Bendis and the main character is supposed to be a minor marvel character "Jewel" that has retired her cape. Does anyone know which comics she appeared in or is her alter ego fabricated for Alias only?

			*	*	*

Re: Jewel AKA Jessica Jones
Posted by SKleefeld on May 27, 2003 at 16:03:48:
In Reply to: Jewel AKA Jessica Jones
posted by A Pruett on May 27, 2003 at 15:08:41:

> I have been reading Alias by Brian Micheal Bendis and the main character is supposed to be a minor marvel character "Jewel" that has retired her cape. Does anyone know which comics she appeared in or is her alter ego fabricated for Alias only?

This is a prime example of retroactive continuity. Jessica Jones was created expressly for Alias and -- has not appeared anywhere else as either Jewel or Knightress.

In fact, I believe her only appearances AT ALL outside of Alias are a handful of cameos as Jessica Jones in recent Daredevil issues also written by Brian Michael Bendis.

-- Sean

			*	*	*

Phoenix III/Rachel Summers Chronology Question
Posted by John on May 27, 2003 at 15:10:37:

I posted this a while back and never got an answer so I'm hoping this time someone will help me out.  In the Rachel chronology, there is a listing for MCP 73/3.  I can not find an appearance by Rachel in this issue anywhere.  Could someone point it out to me or address the fact that there may have been a mistake made when this issue of Marvel Comics Presents was listed.  Is it possible she was in a different issue of MCP and this number was incorrectly listed?

			*	*	*

Re: Phoenix III/Rachel Summers Chronology Question
Posted by Jeph! on May 27, 2003 at 21:32:36:
In Reply to: Phoenix III/Rachel Summers Chronology Question
posted by John on May 27, 2003 at 15:10:37:

It's a typo for M/CP 75/3.

Thanks for being persistent.  :-)

-Jeph!

			*	*	*

newbie
Posted by thomas daley on May 28, 2003 at 00:32:35:

i just discovered this page, and i'm up to the challenge of "auditing" my punisher collection - how do i know which issues need being done? where should i send my synopsis?

			*	*	*

Re: newbie
Posted by Jhaeman on May 28, 2003 at 00:50:18:
In Reply to: newbie
posted by thomas daley on May 28, 2003 at 00:32:35:

The best place to start is to read the FAQ on the sidebar, followed by the Closing the Gap page.  My guess is that most of the non-gap Punisher issues are already included in the MCP, but it never hurts to have someone double-check them.  Welcome!

			*	*	*

OSIRIS...OX IV...KAREN PAGE
Posted by Arthur Stein on May 29, 2003 at 16:41:50:

new entries marked **

OSIRIS
T 241
**M/TIO 23
IG 2

OX IV
**AF 64 (unnamed, in shadow, pg 17/4)
**AF  65 (unnamed, in shadow, pg 7/8)
AF 66

PAGE, KAREN
DD 42
**DD 43-FB (pg 3/4  4/5: Karen explains why shes leaving the firm).
--DD 44  *** I am not seeing Karen in DD 44 or DD 46
--DD 46   
DD 47

Note to newcomers. Just to explain what my postings areas an avid Marvelist I had my own version of this Marvel Chronology Project (MCP). I am now comparing the two, and for all character entries in the MCP, I am checking if I have any appearances that may have been overlooked. Validating them. Chronologizing them. Posting them (so others have an opportunity to refute or comment). The aim... to help in the completeness of this magnificent piece of information engineering! 

#91

			*	*	*

Re: OSIRIS...and ISIS and HORUS and SETH
Posted by Don Campbell on May 30, 2003 at 23:40:34:
In Reply to: OSIRIS...OX IV...KAREN PAGE
posted by Arthur Stein on May 29, 2003 at 16:41:50:

> OSIRIS
> T 241
> **M/TIO 23
> IG 2

When I read your posting for Osiris I was pretty sure that he'd appeared somewhere between M/TIO  #23 and IG #2 so I checked out his MCP entry. I was surprised to find that some other appearances had been left out. And when I checked the other Egyptian gods I found that Isis, Horus and Seth were also missing chunks of their appearances. Finally, there aren't even any entries for the Egyptian gods Bes and Khonshu and Anubis (but I haven't actually read any stories in which Anubis appeared, only read OF them).

Anyway, here are the listings for the main four gods of Egypt who have shown up so far in the MU. As Arthur does, I'll mark "new" entries with **.  As a general rule, Osiris, Isis and Horus usually appear together so their entries are rather repetitive.

OSIRIS **[EGYPTIAN GOD]
ROA 3
**T 240-FB
T 239
T 240
T 241
**M/TIO 23
**T 301
**T@ 10
**T 398-FB (Seth absorbs the powers of the other Egyptian gods, including Osiris)
**T 397-BTS
**T 398
**T 399
**T 400
IG 2
<**T2 61>

Note: Two things to point out. First, I had long believed that Osiris was one of the Sky-Fathers present at the gathering of the god-heads shown in THOR #300-FB but, as the Marvel Appendix web-site pointed out, that couldn't have been Osiris since he was already imprisoned by Seth at that time. Second, Osiris most recently appeared in THOR (vol. 2) #61 but that appearance is not included in the MCP because it's too recent.

ISIS **[EGYPTIAN GOD]
**T 240-FB
T 239
T 240
T 241
**M/TIO 23
**T 301
**T 398-FB
**T 397-BTS
**T 398
**T 399
**T 400

HORUS [EGYPTIAN GOD]
**T 240-FB
T 239
T 240
T 241
**M/TIO 23
**T 301
T@ 10
**T 398-FB
**T 397 - voice only
T 398
T 399
T 400

SETH II  **[EGYPTIAN GOD]
**T 240-FB
**PUN2@ 2/4
**H2 257-FB
**T 240-FB
JIM -1
T 240
T 241
**M/TIO 22
**M/TIO 23
**T@ 10
T 386
T 387-BTS
T 389-BTS
T 390
T 393-BTS
T 395
T 396
T 397
T 398
T 399
WCA2 41
T 400
TS 13-BTS
TS 14-BTS
TS 17
TS 18
TS 19
TS 20
TS 21
TS 22-BTS
TS 23
JIM 503-BTS
JIM 504-BTS
JIM 508
JIM 509
JIM 510
JIM 511
JIM 512
JIM 513

Note: The story in PUN2@ 2/4 may take place before the earliest of the flashbacks in T 240. There's no way to know. And thanks to the Marvel Appendix for reminding me of Seth's appearances in PUNISHER (Vol. 2) Annual #2 and INCREDIBLE HULK #257. I had completely forgotten them.

Don Campbell

			*	*	*

Millie The Model !!!!!!!!!
Posted by jgbook2002 on May 29, 2003 at 21:27:02:

Okay , SERIOUSLY , what appearwances has Millie The Model made in the Marvel Universe ? Yes , I'm aware that the actual Millie titles are , probably , as non-MU as HEATHCLIFF - But , there have been quite a # of Millie references in MU titles , I believe , some of them fairly contradictory !

  Way back in the 70s , when Patsy Walker was brought into the MU , I thought a Millie would be added...

Incidentally , I am of the theory that , in the MU , the Millies published could reflect at least 4 different models active at different times - In the " MU " , " Millie " is a nickname that has been applied to lots of models - like boxers named " Sugar Ray " in ours !!!!!!!!! This goes for any other Millie characters/concepts , too ( Chili , Clicker , the Hanover Modeling Agency...)

			*	*	*

Re: Millie The       !!!!!!!!!
Posted by jgbook2002 on May 30, 2003 at 11:47:47:
In Reply to: Millie The       !!!!!!!!!
posted by jgbook2002 on May 29, 2003 at 21:27:02:

...I saw , late yesterday , the listing for Millie , under her real last name ( Which escapes me right now ! )...I had just looked under " M " before...It was too late for me to acknowledge that then . 

  However , my question still remains , even beyond the several Millie appearasnces/references I can think of that are not listed , FF Annual #3 being the most prominent !

 what appearwances has Millie The       made in the Marvel Universe ? Yes , I'm aware that the actual Millie titles are , probably , as non-MU as HEATHCLIFF - But , there have been quite a # of Millie references in MU titles , I believe , some of them fairly contradictory !

			*	*	*

Re: Millie The       !!!!!!!!!
Posted by ShadZ on May 30, 2003 at 12:23:54:
In Reply to: Re: Millie The       !!!!!!!!!
posted by jgbook2002 on May 30, 2003 at 11:47:47:

The only other appearance of Millie in a super-hero comic that seems to be missing is her appearance in an issue of DEFENDERS.  I don't know the number, but it was when David Anthony Kraft was writing...

>  what appearwances has Millie The       made in the Marvel Universe ? Yes , I'm aware that the actual Millie titles are , probably , as non-MU as HEATHCLIFF - But , there have been quite a # of Millie references in MU titles , I believe , some of them fairly contradictory !

I can only think of the four that we have listed so far (the two already in the project, FF ANNUAL #3, and the DEFENDERS issue). And they don't have any contradictions.  All of her appearnces since the DEFENDERS story have had her as a retired model now running the Hanover Agency...

And Millie's own comics are in continunity, AFAIK.  At least the ones from 1960 forward (when FF #1 came out).  They aren't in the Project for the same reason SGT. FURY and CONAN and RAWHIDE KID aren't -- the non-superheroes haven't been added yet...

ShadZ

			*	*	*

Millie The Model can be found listed as COLLINS, MILLIE --NB--
Posted by ShadZ on May 30, 2003 at 12:27:45:
In Reply to: Re: Millie The       !!!!!!!!!
posted by ShadZ on May 30, 2003 at 12:23:54:

ShadZ

			*	*	*

Re: Millie The       !!!!!!!!!
Posted by ShadZ on June 21, 2003 at 23:34:17:
In Reply to: Re: Millie The       !!!!!!!!!
posted by ShadZ on May 30, 2003 at 12:23:54:

> The only other appearance of Millie in a super-hero comic that seems to be missing is her appearance in an issue of DEFENDERS.  I don't know the number, but it was when David Anthony Kraft was writing...

The DEFENDERS that Millie Collins appeared in was #65

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Greer Nelson...That Toddlin' Cat ?????????
Posted by jgbook2002 on May 29, 2003 at 21:36:26:

Okay , another Fabulous Femme !!!!!!!!! I seem to recall CAT #1 specifically placing Greer Nelson's civilian life , and her late husband's police career , in Chicago . However , the recent Tigra mini ( Which I only got one issue of , so maybe it's my fault !!!!!!!!! ) , in which Greer , as a human , becomes a cop , among cops who remember her late husband...sure appears to take place in Fun City , as usual , not The City With The Big Shoulders . What gives ?

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Shang-Chi's Father ?????
Posted by jgbook on May 29, 2003 at 21:43:10:

Okay , one more . Has Marvel ever named Shang-Chi's father yo be someone other than the copyrighted , and about as useable as Amos & Andy anyway , Fu Manchu ? If I've missed that...

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Re: Shang-Chi's Father ?????
Posted by Andy Holcombe on June 01, 2003 at 21:21:29:
In Reply to: Shang-Chi's Father ?????
posted by jgbook on May 29, 2003 at 21:43:10:

I don't profess to be a Shang-Chi expert, but I seem to remember someone calling Shang-Chi's father the Yellow Claw in the first Marvel Knights series.  Is there any reason the Yellow Claw and Fu Manchu couldn't be one and the same, or was this just a mistake by whoever said it?

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Re: Shang-Chi's Father ?????
Posted by jgbook2002 on June 02, 2003 at 16:18:04:
In Reply to: Re: Shang-Chi's Father ?????
posted by Andy Holcombe on June 01, 2003 at 21:21:29:

...Oh , good , I'dve suggested just that !!!!!!! Fu Manchu , in case you didn't know , was the creation of a writer ( pen- ) named Sax Rohmer , who died in the late Fifties , so , I assume he's still under copyright . The Yellow Claw was a Marvel creation...Basically , VERY much so , their imitation of Fu Manchu !!!!!!!!! ( Who was still appearing in new novels through Rohmer's life , and had a Fifties TV series , and Hammer - and other ? - films , at least as late as the Sixties , with Christopher Lee - Others ? - in " yellowface " . )...I'd like the Claw to be Shang-Chi's father...but with the suggestion/indication that he , somehow , used a time loop/something to take over the previous father-of-S. C....or , that F. M. was another identity , as you said , although , perhaps , w/a bit more complicatedness than that...that there was , perhaps , a different person...or at least part of one...once ?

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Re: Shang-Chi's Father ?????
Posted by Dimadick on June 10, 2003 at 12:10:52:
In Reply to: >Shang-Chi's Father ?????
posted by jgbook on May 29, 2003 at 21:43:10:

> Okay , one more . Has Marvel ever named Shang-Chi's father yo be someone other than the copyrighted , and about as useable as Amos & Andy anyway , Fu Manchu ? If I've missed that...

In Shang-Chi Master of Kung Fu #1 -November, 2002

Fu Manchu called himself "Comte de Saint Germain".Probably after the historical Comte de Saint Germain(c. 1700 - 1784), a famous European mystic.For more info on the latTer: http://www.alchemylab.com/count_saint_germain.htm#His%20Origins.

Philip Jose Farmer(1918-), a science fiction author who dealt with the origins and biographies of fictional characters created by others, has speculated that Fu Manchu isn't a real name. In his version of the character's history Fu Manchu was born in 1840 as "Ling Fu Shan" to English aristocrat William Clayton and his Chinese mistress Ling Ju Hai. He later operated as "Hanoi Shan" after his birthplace of Hanoi, Vietnam.

Win Scott Eckert, a fan of Farmer has further attempted to create a chronology of Dr. Fu Manchu from various sources. For the following see:http://www.pjfarmer.com/woldnewton/Fumanchu.htm. He has also helped create a chronology of Shang Chi. See:http://www.pjfarmer.com/woldnewton/Shangchi.htm.

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Detective Tyrone King
Posted by garbonzo on May 29, 2003 at 22:40:01:

Detective Tyrone King appeared in many of the later issues of PMIF.  At the end of issue 125 hie is consumed in a fireball, yet somehow just pats out the fire.  After searching the MCP, i cannot find him listed anywhere.  Was he later revealed to be a) an android, b) skrull, c) Hy'lthri, d) Doombot, e) just some minor character that has been overlooked in the project and needs someone to go back and catalog his appearances (I'll volunteer)?  Does anyone know of any post-PMIF 125 appearances?  Possibly in Namor or any of the PMIF/H4H titles?

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Re: Detective Tyrone King
Posted by The Beetle on May 30, 2003 at 03:59:53:
In Reply to: Detective Tyrone King
posted by garbonzo on May 29, 2003 at 22:40:01:

He is there, just look under Master Khan, since Tyrone King was revealed as Master Khan in Namor, The Sub-Mariner

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Ann Weying
Posted by Faltina on May 30, 2003 at 00:39:56:

Ann Weying, Eddie Brock/Venom's ex-wife appeared in a few books you don't have listed:

Venom: Sinner Takes All #'s 1-5
Rune Vs. Venom one shot

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Sun      & Patriotic      ?
Posted by jgbook on May 30, 2003 at 11:56:01:

I see that Sun      , who was the original Human Torch's assistant , either replacing or supplementing Toro , in his last year or so of Timely stories , is not listed . Does this back up that Marvel has , never , officailly acknowledged her ? Likewise for the Female Buck-babe that Captain America , at the same time , picked up , Patriotic      or whatever . Neither of the two have ever been " adopted " ?

( NOTE: YES , I'm being FACETIOUS/HUMOROUS with the " Pat.      " name ! ) 

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Re: 40s Marvel Female Assistants .
Posted by jgbook2002 on June 03, 2003 at 17:27:44:
In Reply to: Sun      & Patriotic      ?
posted by jgbook on May 30, 2003 at 11:56:01:

...Perhaps I was overly cute/assumed too much Golden Age knowledge . ( Also , unfortunately , I am typing this at a computer so censortious , that it will not print the standard English term for " young woman " - rhymes with " Shirl " . So , I'll try that , )

At the end of their 40s series , 
Submariner , 
the Human Torch , and
Captain America  
acquired young       female assistants , 
Namora ,
Sun " Shirl " , 
...Patriotic Patsy ? America      ? Yes , I've , if I ever knew , forgotten , which would make this even harder , I will admit ! ( Oh , jeez , will this computer write the word between " even " , and " I " , above ??????? )

  Namora was included in modern , Marvel Age and beyond , continuity . Have Sun " Shirl " and Patriot      ? SG isn't listed here , which suggests not .

 Again , in the last year or so of the " Essential Three " of Timely character's series' , 1948-49 , they all acquired female assistants , supplanting Toro and Bucky ( Or , supplementing , I suppose ? ) for the two non-water-breathers .I dio9n't recall any , moderm , Marvel story acknomledgeing them - Or ruling them out for that matter . Anyone ?

> I see that Sun      , who was the original Human Torch's assistant , either replacing or supplementing Toro , in his last year or so of Timely stories , is not listed . Does this back up that Marvel has , never , officailly acknowledged her ? Likewise for the Female Buck-babe that Captain America , at the same time , picked up , Patriotic      or whatever . Neither of the two have ever been " adopted " ?

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Golden Girl
Posted by Arthur Stein on June 03, 2003 at 18:22:56:
In Reply to: Re: 40s Marvel Female Assistants .
posted by jgbook2002 on June 03, 2003 at 17:27:44:

Captain America III's female partner was Golden Girl

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Re: Golden Girl
Posted by jgbook2002 on June 04, 2003 at 00:51:06:
In Reply to: Golden Girl
posted by Arthur Stein on June 03, 2003 at 18:22:56:

> Captain America III's female partner was Golden Girl

...Okay , so that's who it was in modern Marvel history , AND , that's what the original comics had ? ( Yes , obviously , not mentioning that it was Cap #3 ! ) Thank you !!! I didn't seem to see GG listed next to any of the Caps - I'm posting , now , at an expensive cybercafe , so , I'll hold on checking the back listings till later .

  Answer to the other guy: I was writing from a Catholic-funded ( Jesuit , actually . ) social service organization's office . ( There are no priests/religious working there , and I'm not one , or Catholic , either . ) That computer , anyway , seemed to have an especially Monty Python-esque Department Of Silly Censors block placed upon it: It won't print the first syllable of Batman's home city , the first syllable of the organization that Robin and Aqualad belong to , or the 1st syl. of the company that publishes Simpsons comics !!!!!

  So Sun Girl's never been confirmed/denied ? How about Subbie , Sub-Mariner's nephew ? The Young Allies and the non-super , kid , members ???  

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Re: Golden Girl
Posted by ShadZ on June 04, 2003 at 19:34:59:
In Reply to: Re: Golden Girl
posted by jgbook2002 on June 04, 2003 at 00:51:06:

>   So Sun Girl's never been confirmed/denied ? 

Sun Girl's existence in the Marvel Universe was confirmed in the Saga of the Original Human Torch mini-series.  I notice that SotOHT is not in the key, so I suppose it is in one of the gaps...

ShadZ

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Re: Golden Girl
Posted by John Gizzi on July 02, 2003 at 13:59:34:
In Reply to: Re: Golden Girl
posted by ShadZ on June 04, 2003 at 19:34:59:

Has there been any mention of Sun Girl or Golden Girl since the late '40's?  A revival or "whatever happened to feature?" would be a major hit.  Betty Dean aged well with the times, so why not the others.  As I recall, Golden Girl was Betty Ross, the FBI agent, and Sun Girl was Mary Mitchell, Human Torch's secretary.  They must have both had fascinating careers and, remember, in Sun Girl #3, someone recalls how she helped straighten him out as a child so she must have operated well into the 1960's.  Any thoughts?

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Censoring Computers?
Posted by Jeph! on June 03, 2003 at 19:55:30:
In Reply to: Re: 40s Marvel Female Assistants 
posted by jgbook2002 on June 03, 2003 at 17:27:44:

> unfortunately , I am typing this at a computer so censortious , that it will not print the standard English term for " young woman " - rhymes with " Shirl "

Where the hell are you writing from?

-Jeph!

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Pluto/Devil
Posted by Mithrandir on May 31, 2003 at 11:24:19:

In the golden age "Hurricane" stories, there is a villian alternately known as Pluto and/or the Devil.  Is this an early appearance of the Olympian Pluto?  Or possibly a pseudonym emplyed by Mephisto?

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Hurricane later revealed to Makkari; so maybe it was Kro!
Posted by John McDonagh on May 31, 2003 at 14:27:03:
In Reply to: Pluto/Devil
posted by Mithrandir on May 31, 2003 at 11:24:19:

Actually, Hurricane was later revealed to be Eternal Makkari, so it was Kro!

http://www.vortex.bridgwater.ac.uk/mtlg/hurricane.htm

Red Raven Comics #1 (Makkari first came to Earth posing as Jake Curtiss aka Mercury); Captain America Comics #1 (Makkari resurfaced posing as Hurricane (son of Thor), battled 'the Devil' (who was actually Warlord Kro), defeated Kro); Marvel Mystery Comics #1 (alongside Dr. Ruth Holden and Dr. Ralph Rand visited the jungles of Matto Grosso to help cure a plague sent by Pluto (actually Warlord Kro), the natives capture Holden and Rand and they are sentenced to death, Hurricane freed them from their prison and from angry natives, after sending the Doctors to safety he destroys the native's home of Jivaro City to teach them a lesson); Marvel Universe #4 - #7 (posed as Jake Curtiss, met Doctor Druid after the first attack ofthe monsters, at the Explorer's Club met up with Zawadi and Ulysses Bloodstone, showed the soon-to-be Monster Hunters photos of Gorgilla, after fighting several monsters as Jake Curtiss revealed himself to be Hurricane, captured by Kro (still posing as the Devil), finally revealed his true form as Makkari, with the help of the Monster Hunters fought Warlork Kro, defeated Kro and his monsters, levitated the Monsters Hunters back home); Marvel: TLG #2 (in 1958, with the rest of the Monster Hunters (2nd line-up), Hurricane (as Mac Curry) fought alongside The Yankee Clipper (II), Liberty Girl and the Black Fox against a monster attacking a Long Island Research Centre, the monster turned out to be a human transformed by an alien device). Note: Makkari later went on to become Major Mercury - see entry for details

http://www.geocities.com/brenni_au/Roger.html

#11: Why did you decide to make the Golden Age hero Hurricane into Makkari? Does this revelation mean that the other "gods" seen in Red Raven Comics#1 (Zeus, Minerva, Vulcan, Apollo, etc.) were actually their Eternals counterparts? 

Perhaps.  It just made sense that all these various incarnations of Kirby "speed-gods" were one and the same. 

Tales from the Marvel Universe #4-6 - Monster Hunters story with Doctor Druid, Ulysses Bloodstone, Hurricane, and retconned-in character Zawadi battling creatures from Monster Island. Features my all-time single favorite retcon, the revelation that all of Jack Kirby's heroic speedsters (Hurricane, Mercury, Adam Clayton, and Makkari) are the same character, a nice save as the former pair's origins are untenable in the current Marvel Universe. The character has also appeared (which I think is stretching him a bit too thin) as "Major Mercury" in Stern and Byrne's Lost Generation.

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Re: Hurricane later revealed to Makkari; so maybe it was Kro!
Posted by Mithrandir on June 02, 2003 at 16:04:54:
In Reply to: Hurricane later revealed to Makkari; so maybe it was Kro!
posted by John McDonagh on May 31, 2003 at 14:27:03:

Very interesting.  Do you by any chance know that actualy issue/date in which the Hurricane/Makkari connection was revealed?  (My own personal chronology has "defunct" entries for those appearances which are retconned away so a date would be useful for determining at what point my entry under Pluto ceases to "count.")

--Tom Bradford

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Re: Hurricane later revealed to Makkari; so maybe it was Kro!
Posted by Peter Fabricius on June 03, 2003 at 01:33:46:
In Reply to: Re: Hurricane later revealed to Makkari; so maybe it was Kro!
posted by Mithrandir on June 02, 2003 at 16:04:54:

I can supply that.

Marvel Universe #6 cover date November 1998 for Makkari/Hurricane

The Kro/Satan revelation was in #7 (December 1998)

Peter

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Living Tribunal in GotGalaxy; since he is a multiversal singularity, would those be included in his entry?
Posted by John McDonagh on May 31, 2003 at 14:33:47:

    The issue of the Living Tribunal representing a multiversal singularity came up a while ago.......namely, that the Living Tribunal does not have alternate Earth counterparts, but rather only one Living Tribunal exists for the whole multiverse. This came up in What If I#32.

    Now, considering this, that would mean that the Living Tribunal's appearances in the Guardians of the Galaxy stories (such as in issue #49) would represent the same entity as the one who appears in Earth-616 stories, because even though Guardians of the Galaxy takes place on an alternate Earth, there is only one Living Tribunal in the whole multiverse anyway! 

    Probably those Guardians of the Galaxy issues are in one of the gaps, but still, I thought this was a fun bit of trivia to bring up. 

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Seth; should Moon Knight IV be added to his listing, since he was certainly the "Set" seen in those issues?
Posted by John McDonagh on May 31, 2003 at 14:51:32:

    I asked this a while ago, and Don Campbell recent Set related posting reminded me of this:

    In Moon Knight IV (which is not in the Gap as I see it in the entry for Moon Knight and Werwolf) the Egyptian god Set appears. Now, writer Doug Mouench does not refer to him as "Seth" at any point in the series, nor does the god appear in the costume seen in Seth's other appearances; HOWEVER, he is described as Osiris' brother, so this Set was NOT the Elder God Set from Conan and Atlantis Attacks. 

     Fortuneately, Moon Knight IV came out a year after Seth's Journey Into Mystery appearances so:

*MK IV#1
*MK IV#2
*MK IV#3
*MK IV#4
